hide, Kami, Kazuki, Shaisuke...

[Sutoroberiurei]

I'm sick and tired of hearing people talk about dead Jrockers as if that's all they should be remembered for: their deaths! All of these guys (even the ones I couldn't fit) were Jrockers; it was the music we should remember them for. If they weren't musicians, I doubt as many people would know about their deaths :okashii: I was especially distressed with hide's and Kazuki's deaths. The scariest thing for me,though, was hide's death. I remember it was two days before my eighth birthday, and I turned on the tv, flipping through the channels slowly until I reached CNN. A lot of news from around the country comes to that channel, and this was right around the time when I had first fallen madly in love with anime and Japan in general. As I was about to keep surfing, I heard something mentioned about an area in Japan, and I listened. I had no idea then that it would be so "important"(for lack of a better word) to me, but they were talking about "Japanese rock superstar Matsumoto Hideto, ex-member of popular band X-Japan and Spread Beaver." Even though I was eight, and I didn't really care much then, I can almost exactly recal the words: "Matsumoto Hideto, member of one of the highest-selling bands in Japanese music history, has died in the hosptal today, just hours after having hung himself from his bathroom doorknob with a towel. One person has mentioned that this accident could've been possible because of a planned 'fake suicide' the guitarist was to present at a later show." It really struck a chord in me once I got older and began to listen to X-Japan, Spread Beaver, etc. It's unfortunate that he died, but it's even more unfortunate to me that many people (myself included) will never be able to enjoy his music again, outside of what he has already given us. It was a little strange to me that something that bad happened right before my birthday... Anyone else wanna add anything?

[Kamisama]

you're sig is too big. I mention GG Allin. He's dead. I don't see any good artists like him though. Dead guys are kinda cool.

[Sutoroberiurei]

Meh, sorry aboot the siggy ^^;;; Though... Excuse me if I overlooked, but I didn't see anything about sig size anywhere... I'm guessing he's cool? I've never heard of him before.

[Horizon]

Yeah, I see your point in people going on and on about how they're dead, ne. That is kind of annoying actually.

I just can't stand it when someone insults one of them for now good reason and with un-original ones (insults that is) at that.

That's really the only time I mention hide's death, because I have a tendency not to like it very much when people insult the dead, unless it was because they were doing something stupid or something...Especially since hide was a very good musician too (not like I have to tell any of you that ^^;;) and he definately doesn't deserve to have his music (or himself for that matter) dissed and insulted like sh*t just because he's Japanese, or because he sings in Japanese, or because he has a Japanese accent, yatta, yatta.

[Sutoroberiurei]

I know what you mean -_-;;; Another thing about that that bothers me, though, is when people get involved in the whole "Japanese-English Language Barrier" thing. If I have to hear another person mention about how funny Jrockers sound with their "Engrish" accents, I will explode >.< All over them, too, I might add :okashii: I personally think that if you call yourself a fan but eventually won't listen to a group because of language issues, then you're not a fan. We don't need thousands of effeminate, guitar-totting men in dresses running to pick up "Annaisho Dzuki Amerikan no Hakuchi". >.< I think everything sounds better in the native language (Remember "Feel the Fire"? o.O Good song, but a little too weird for me...).

[Horizon]

Yeah, I kinda agree. I don't think langauge should be a barrier, especially if it's in the case of music, even more so if it's actually GOOD music. Music is just entertainment and a way to pass on yourself and your emotions so to speak. Language has nothing to do with it and what emotional songs I have heard are more emotional-sounding to me than most of the emotional English music I've heard, not to sound closed-minded or anything.

A lot of people around here where I live (and probably more places) I think have a tendency to forget that a lot of people who can barely speak a word of English listen to English music.

As for the English in the music, it depends on why it's being done, although, as far as JRockers go, they probably just do it to sound cool and whatnot, so yeah. I suppose so, but if its to reach more English-speaking people and try to convert them, then I really don't mind that ^^;;

Yeah, I never really liked the term 'Engrish', especially since I read this one thing written by a person who thinks calling their accents "Engrish", even if it's in an affectionate way, is like saying something along the lines of "Haha! Look at the little yellow people trying to speak our language!"

So, yeah, that totally lost what little appeal I had for the word...

I can't understand most (and by most, I mean like 99.9%) of "To Feel the Fire" anyway, so I'm good.

[mizerable_d]

dead guys are memorable, but the dead guy i am so annoyed of is Kurt Cobain. geez, ppl talk about him everwhere, and all the time. i mean he made some good music but wtf? he's not like god o anything...

also, the reason most asian singers would add english to theirs songs, is cuz it's kind of "in" in asia

[Horizon]

Yeah, I know that. For some reason or another Asians somehow LIKE Western stuff. Weird people they are (no offense! xD)

And yeah, Kurt Cobain's death is quite annoying. I kind of got into a fight with someone, like, two days ago about him and hide or whatever. Can't remember most of it, but the person was insulting hide or something for comitting suicide and yet...Kurt Cobain (unless his wife really killed him, but unless she comes clean, no one's ever going to know whether it's true or not).

But that just SO pissed me off completely >.>

[mizerable_d]

yes i like hide better than kurt...kurt just have too many whorshipers who are constantly talking about his death...

[Sutoroberiurei]

I've also had enough with these little "Kurt freaks". His music was okay, but it isn't something to base your Life on. If you go around saying, "I'm going to be in a rock and roll band and take drugs and what not, just like Kurt Cobaaaaiiiiinnnnn!", then I really lose all respect for the person. People who say that, I think, tend to believe that they can make something happen by living someone else's fantasies/reality. Do it for yourself, man >.<! Now, the whole "Asians liking Western stuff"... Well, aren't there a lot of English people who like Japanese stuff, or Spanish, or German stuff? I don't really think it's whether it's "in" or not in that country, but whether you as a person find the music to your tastes. My mom makes a big deal that I listen to Dir en grey and Malice Mizer all the time ("What is that creepy-sounding crap?! I can't even understand the freakin' lyrics!"), but she constantly questions why I won't tolerate listening to my friend's Morning Musume and BoA albums. I just don't like their music. All those bands are Japanese, but does it mean that I should love all Japanese music, just because it's Japanese? And the "Engrish" thingy; I feel the same way. I think it's sort of insulting to say that a Japanese person speaks "Engrish" or has an "Engrish" accent. Granted it might be funny to hear someone who's Japanese pronounce the first English word they've ever heard/seen in their entire Life, I don't think it's funny however when you say that someone who's trying their hardest to speak this new language is failing. And making a joke out of it is even worse than bluntly telling them, "You suck at English." How do you think they feel when they hear Americans trying to speak Japanese? I think it's the same exact thing, no matter what language. You'll always have someone willing to joke about it. Off to the side... How are you supposed to pronounce 'hide' right >.<?! I have a very argumentative friend telling me to say it like "HIDE and go-seek" hide. I personally pronounce it "hee-deh", but I also tend to say Gackt as "Gak-u-to" ^^;;; Please, no one mock me 9_9;;;

[Illaparatzo-sama]

Only thing that irritates me is seeing, whenever people mention Kami, (r.i.p. ;_;) next to his name. Yes, he's dead. Get over it, you probably hadn't even heard of him when he did die and finding out 3, 4, 5 years later and acting like you care is just annoying. Don't hear too many people bemoan the fate of Shaisuke, I do believe he is largely forgotten by now. He's been dead a while and Baiser never was too popular with foreign VK fans. hide... don't see too many people crying over him either. His music is very much enjoyed by his fans, and usually you only see things pop up on his birthday or his death day, which I think is just fine.

Kazuki... Ohhh, Kazuki. He's the one I find to be a real tragedy. Really terrible what happened to him, when he was so young and Raphael was getting to be a success, being major and all that. Sad, sad, sad. But I still don't see people whining over him like they do with Kami.

KAMI IS A REPEAT OFFENDER. :|

Honestly though, I really don't see a lot of people making more of a deal over any of their deaths than their music. EXCEPT KAMI. He was a drummer, he drummed and he drummed well. However you cannot say of his music the kind of stuff you could say had he been a guitarist or a vocalist. Simply cannnot.

hide's name was Hideto, you pronounce it like you're supposed to. hee deh toh.

Lydia

[Horizon]

If you don't mind me asking Lydia, what happened to Kazuki, ne? And Shaisuke too?

[Kama]

I liked hearing Hide's music, and Kami's and it sadden me that they won't play any longer. But they do created fine music, and I'll pay my rtespect for this, not to pay respect just because that they are dead.

It is said if the band disband or the musician is dead, the band/musician gains more popularity. I don't understand this.

[Horizon]

Maybe it's because people like what they can't have more than what they can have and if the band is disbanded or the person is dead, you more than likely can't get anymore music, unless they're like Tupac or something?

Or maybe it's because people are stupid and want to make it appear like they're caring or something?

Or maybe, in the case of the deceased, it could just be because they ARE dead...

But more than likely, the world will never know

[Illaparatzo-sama]

Shaisuke died in a car accident, Kazuki died of a tranquilizer overdose.

[PrincessBerriKiller]

hmm, yes. I don't quite obsess over the death as much as the music. I obsess (well, not really) over the fact that now that they are dead I can no longer hear more of the wonderful music they had once brought to my ears...That in truth is what can make me sad.

[mizerable_d]

haha, nice comment there about Tupac, Horizon...
i think bands dont get more popular when they disband, i think that their albums just become more expensive. i bought a smashing pumpkin cd a year ago and it was like $45.99. i really liked them so i bought it but still its so expensive.

[Horizon]

Shaisuke died in a car accident, Kazuki died of a tranquilizer overdose.

Oi...That is really sad...


And it's the truth, ne. Tupac still has things coming out: cds, movies, blah, blah. It's annoying, really. Especially since one girl I hung out with actually thought he was coming back. That he wasn't really dead. She was all excited the day before and the day that he was supposed to come back. She actually really thought he'd come back. Then when he didn't, the next day, she was SO depressed. It's was just so arg...

[mizerable_d]

haha, poor people...

[Sutoroberiurei]

I find it interesting that more people tend to care about the deceased person after they've died, rather than before it happened. Usually, with people like that, they tend to make others believe they actually liked the music they played or liked the movies they were in or whatever, and they only just heard about that person, maybe even many years after they've died. If anything, I'd like to tell these people not to base their supposed "fanship" on that musician/actor/author's death so it sounds like they knew their music or writing or whatnot and now they're completely affected by their death; those people need to get a brain. The deceased (I feel) should be remembered for all that they did when they were alive, because that truly is the only way a few people can talk about them. Take hide's case; I remember him for his music. His death, honestly, didn't affect me much back then because I didn't really think he mattered to me at the time. Now, he does matter because I know how great he was with his guitar. But I'm not the kind of person running around doing either of two things... 1) "Oh, hide's dead, so I'll never get to hear his music again! Boo hoo! Life is TERRIBLE now!" ...No. I'm pretty unhappy with the fact that I can never hear new songs from him, but I also give myself a reality check and say that the music he has given his fans should be enough for them. 2) "Oh, yeah, hide? Phht, I know his music! I LOVE his music, man! It's so SAD that he died..." hide? Who the HELL is hide? I'll just pretend like I know who he is so it sounds like I care and I'm into Jrock/Japanese whatever... ...That, right there, that's f***in' pathetic. If you don't know who the person is, be a f***in' human being and act like it. Don't throw fake feelings around like you actually cared for this person; what about the people that feel genuinely awful about it? Act like you know what the hell is going on; people respect you more that way. And, you actually start to seem like you know a thing or two about this person.

[mizerable_d]

similar with art. a painter would be like broke and starving in his/her lifetime, but after they are dead, their paintings cost millions...wtf is all i can say.

i got to know about hide after he died, i think its sad but not obsessed about it. i think that its too bad that he cant make anymore music. T_T o well i can always listen to his old ones, no? kami's death i heard about also after his death, but i am sad not only cuz he died, but also cuz Malice Mizer broke up. i really like their songs and style, it's unique and classy. now that they broke up, the members are making different music than the MM style. T_Ti guess it couldnt be helped.

[Horizon]

Same with me. I heard about hide's death not all that long ago (before I liked him actually...), but I'm not all obsessive over it. I mourn a bit, yes, because it's sad we're never going to hear any more music from him, and that X isn't ever going to re-group, and all of that, but I'm not like, basinf my fandom on his death like Sutoroberiurei said, ne.

I heard of Kami's death and I still don't like Malice Mizer much...(Don't kill me!)

And about the artist thing, that's really, really sad. I always thought that...

[mizerable_d]

*strangles Horizon ofr not likin MM* o you said NOT to kill you...*stops*

lol jks jks jks

poor poor painters...T_T

[PrincessBerriKiller]

ha...MM is quite good but not one of my most favourite-ist favourites....

I think it is silly to obsess over things you wouldnt obsess over in the first place.

[Sutoroberiurei]

I really did like MM, though I could've gone without Tetsu... I'm trying to get into Moi Dix Mois because I admire Mana for what he can do, but that's easier said than done. Now, off-topic... I have an issue with people who aren't into something or don't know about what they pretend to know about (Does ANYONE understand what I just said o.O?!). For example, the ٨ucifer-Ahzifer incident. Just yesterday at my Anime Club meeting (Yes! I'm an otaku!), a new girl came in for her first time and tried to find a seat. Seeing one of the seats closest to the front (My friend's seat...) was "available," she decided to sit her keister down in it before my friend got to (...RUDE!!!). Also, she just decided it was her privilege to yank my binder from my hands (...GREEDY-RUDE!!!) and look at it, turning it over and examining it and what-not. All of a sudden, she looked up at me with a gigantic smiley-happy face and said, "Hey, you like (and this is where it get HILARIOUS.) Ahzifer, too?!" ...AHZIFER?! Where did she get THAT name?! Did she just HAPPEN to pull it out of thin air?! I mean, the picture had the name right on it! I had "٨UCIFER" in big font in the top right corner, and in the lower left corner was "Lucifer..." in cursive script (::Blesses Picture It! 7.0). That made me laugh (Though internally. I'm nice!). Later, I told my cousin (She is definately the biggest ٨ucifer fan I know...) and she found this to be quite funny as well.

[mizerable_d]

that is indeed funny. haha Ahzifer...poor poor girl...

[Illaparatzo-sama]

Urr... perhaps the girl did like Lucifer, but didn't realize how it was pronounced? I hear people saying "Malice Miser" all the time, even when they've been fans for a while.

[Horizon]

I say Malice Miser or Mitzer since I don't know how pronounce it. Or I just say Malice ^^;;

And I will admit, they are pretty good, but I'm just not into them right at this moment. Later maybe.

And why the HELL does EVERYONE strangle me?!?!?!?

I used to say something like "Ewcifer", until I discovered they were "Lucifer"

Sad, sad me...;.;

[Sutoroberiurei]

Urr... perhaps the girl did like Lucifer, but didn't realize how it was pronounced?

Hey, you got a point... Actually, I did talk with that girl a little yesterday at school... She's still got the "pronunciation issue" disease. I didn't get mad at her for this, but... A little peeved. Here's what happened (any 'typos' are how she pronounced them):
Her: Oh, you're the girl I met in Anime Club! Hey!
Me: Oh, eh, hi?..
Her: Hey, what other bands do you like, I saw that Ahzifer picture on your binder and I was like "whoa..."!
Me: Heh, thanks... Um... Above all, it's mostly Jrock. You know, the works.
Her: Oh, yeah! I love Jrock music, I'm a big fan!
Me: Oh? What're your favorite Jrock bands?
Her: Hum... I like Camee Gackt, X Japan, Glay (I always believed it pronounced "guh-ray"), Deer in Grey (o.O;;;;;;;), Malisay Meetzer, and Morning Mahsamnay.
Me: (Ka-blink) ...Uh, wow, that a few...
Do you see were I may be a bit confused?! I just wish I knew FOR sure these pronunciations, and that other people did as well. For all get's confusing in Faith-chan Land >_<;;;

[StarCrap]

that is indeed funny. haha Ahzifer...poor poor girl...


Ahzifer!!!!??? Haha....hahaha...awwwwwww. The girl just needs someone to lead her the way. But Ahzifer!!! That name got killed....

[Illaparatzo-sama]

K.

GLAY = GAY WITH AN L. It's based on the color grey.

Dir en grey = ヂルアングレイ = diru an gurei. Dir as in deer, an pronounced as in entropy, grey as in the er.. color grey. ...Diru for short. Got it?

...and in case you were wondering, Malice Mizer = マリスミゼル = marisu mizeru = Malice Mihzer. Moi Dix Mois =, of course, mwa dees mwa, モワヂイスモワ。

It's easy to learn how to pronounce them if you can read their names in katakana or hiragana, as they are often printed.

Lydia

[Kama]

Glay is called glay, because they are not black or white, and yes, they know that's a "misspelling" in English. :P

I heard from French-speaking girl: Moi Dix Mois is Mwa Di Mwa. :D [Don't be offended, but I hate American pronunciation XD Isn't deer something like "di-ru" rather not dir?]

Morning Mahsamnay - what is it? I only know Morning Musumne, could it be this? :D

[Illaparatzo-sama]

It's di-ru if you're Japanese. Same as Nightmare is "Naitome-a" if you're Japanese. But since you're not, I'd think you'd pronounce it as it's supposed to be. =P

Same as people with their "Gakuto"... -_______-

[Sutoroberiurei]

Morning Mahsamnay - what is it? I only know Morning Musumne, could it be this? :D

Yeah, she meant Morning Musume, but... She was way off -_-;;; And Moi Dix Mois... Well, I always thought it was pronounced like "mwah dees mwaz", seeing as "moi" is me in french, but "mois" is months (I think! I'm only taking French one!). I assume since the two are different, the pronunciation is different. Gackuto... I'm used to saying that rather than "Gackt" because I first learned about his music through a Japanese friend, and she always refered to him as that. Perhaps the pronunciation is all about where you've heard it from? :P

[Misake]

I'm sorry, are you sure is was Mwa Di Mwa, not Mwa Dis Mwa... parce-ce que je parle franais et en francais c'est Mwa Dis Mwa. J'habit au Quebec. (I wrote in French to prove that I do know the language) By the way it means "My Ten Months" for the people who didn't know.

I randomly pronouse Malice Mizer in 3 ways, Malice My-zer, Malice Mee-zer, Marisu Misuru

Glay is Glay unless I pronouce it in Japanese.

^ucifer, I didn't know how to pronounce it until I read the entries in this forum.

I pronouce Gackt as Gackt or Gakuto-san.

I pronouce Dir en Grey, in French. Something like Dzeer un Goo-rlay (...I hope that makes sense... I prounce the r in Grey like in Japanese, which is between a L and a R.) but it's just easier saying Diru.

L'arc en Ciel - (aka The Rainbow ^.~lol) larc un See elle

Anyway, I came here because I wanted to know more about other dead Jrockers, other than the ones I know. Planning to go to Otakukon next year with some friends. And I'm planning on cosplaying as Kami (Illuminati & Au Revoir) ^^ on of my friends is dressing up like hide and we wanted to have a group of dead Jrockers... I know it sounds morbid... but It's kind of to remember them and honour them. Of course we aren't going to dress like anyone we don't really like, because that wouldn't be right, ne? But I just learnt of Kazuki in Raphael and dl some stuff, I think it's pretty good ^^. So Some will probably dress like him too. I wanted some other people. Which I did see Shaisuke for Baiser, but are there any others? Thanks.

[Kinsao]

I'm sorry, are you sure is was Mwa Di Mwa, not Mwa Dis Mwa... parce-ce que je parle franais et en francais c'est Mwa Dis Mwa. J'habit au Quebec. (I wrote in French to prove that I do know the language) By the way it means "My Ten Months" for the people who didn't know.

Hello Misake, it's nice to meet you! :hey: Wow, I didn't realise this thread existed, you must have looked many pages to find it! :relief:

Ah, so you are French-speaking person living in Canada! And you pronounce the "Dis" of "Moi dis Mois" with the "s" on the end? I always pronounced it without the "s"... Hey, but in fact I don't know any Canadian people, so maybe there is something of difference in the French-Canadian way of pronunciation? :? (Of course, I could just be quite wrong, but I'll pretend that's not possible... :blush: )

Really, I know Malice Mizer is meant to be pronounced "malice mizere" (missing accent grave but this computer I'm using turns all my accents into little boxes :okashii: ), but somehow in my head I am still thinking "my-zer" :D probably because I just like the sound of the word XDD

Anyway, I came here because I wanted to know more about other dead Jrockers, other than the ones I know.

Uhhh... I'm not very helpful about that... because I only know of Kami and Hide. :( But your cosplay idea sounds good. :cool: They would both make a cool cosplay I think!

[Dreadlocked Shinya]

Shaisuke? I've never heard of him... :sorry:

As for hide and Kami (the two I know most due to their popularity in the music world), I really do like. Kami was a decently good drummer, and hide was incredible. Besides, his vocals were top knotch in my opinion. Then again, I like Tetsu's voice. So, what do I know?

[Sutoroberiurei]

Ai-yah! I didn't think anyone still read this thread :relief: I'm not really sure of any other dead JRockers off the top of my head except those four, but whatever anyone else knows... They're more intelligent than I am :p

[SaKeVi]

Jrockers?? hahahaha.

Well, the most known japanese punk scene deaths are:

Randy Uchida (G.I.S.M.) - He died of cancer in 2001, after that, G.I.S.M. disbanded forever (and I never saw them live... T_T)
Masami (Ghoul) - He died of cancer too in 1992.

See you!!

[advigilo]

uhm those pronoucements are intressting
perhaps make a thread about it?

as for me, i alway pronouced the bands as in english or french.

moi dis moix in french, well because its french obviously.

i try too pronoucence and write the band in the orginal way,
the most reconigebal (cant spell that well) way i think...


hope it makes any sense....

[Yokan]

yes i like hide better than kurt...kurt just have too many whorshipers who are constantly talking about his death...
VERY TRUE :p

[Godrina]

Sadly for me, I didn't even know who Hide was until after his death...Not long after it, but I don't know...his music was so...simply wonderful.

[LikaLaruku]

From what I remember of Shaisuke, he was openly gay & the car accident was ironically "on the way to Hide's funeral." I named a manga bishie after him (even though he looks like Hakuei with long purple hair) & still use that character.

What about the original members of "The Piass?" They all drowned doing a deadly bungee stunt for a music video. Now THAT was tragic....

I was peeved about Kazuki. Rapheal is a rare band for me....I got one of their discs half-off for buying an assload of manga (untranslated) & not one song on the album was boring *_* Plus I didn't see it comming, he always seemed cheerful.

Kami...found out about him after I got into Gackt's solo stuff. 9did you know that CLAMP used him & Izam for inspiration on Ruby Moon?) I was already preoccupied wit the death of NRG's Kim Hwan-Sung at the time. That was NOT a good year for Jrocker health. 9okey, Hwan-sungie-oppa was Korean)

Also peeved that the Hide museum closed before I could see it >.<