How can I memorize combined kanji? [Archive]

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GoldCoinLover

Mar 4, 2005, 13:23

Hello, my name is Kevin. I've been learning japanese for a few months now, (actually over a year off and on), but I don't have a class to go to. So I use the internet (this forum). I'm still memorizing the kana, but I have a very hard time with kanji. For example, the kanji for person I see alot. But alot of times when I combine it with other kanji it doesn't make sense. Or when kana follows combined kanji, its even more confusing.

What can I do to help me learn this?
Why is japanese so hard? :souka:

It seems like an enormous task for any gaijin or non native japanese person.

GaijinPunch

Mar 4, 2005, 15:49

When you say combine, you mean a compound like 人口 ? You can't (always) think of it as "person mouth" as that makes absolutely no sense. In (I'd say) most cases, you really need to learn the vocabulary. There are some kanji that go together quite intuitively... but there are tons that don't.

My best and only advice as a beginner is flash cards for vocabulary... and lots of them. Also read the sentences in your texts (online only will not suffice). Once you get some vocab down, use them in sentences to get a feel.

Is Japanese a hard language? Yes, at the first, it's like pulling teeth. the kana, kanji, synonyms, levels of politeness, and all around weirdness is a lot to absorb. About 3 years into it, you'll get better, and eventually it will click. You'll eventually get to where classes really don't teach you anymore than putting your nose in a book can assuming you have a lot of practice to go with it.

Damicci

Mar 5, 2005, 04:29

I don't think you can really memorize compund kanji because with the many different readings it would be a very difficult task. I think it probably better to learn the readings and take it in context.

I am sure there are times when you may see compund kanji and it means something totally different than b4 i havee yet to see this but I am sure it is out there.

Just learn the readings and meanings of each kanji seperately.

I think any language is hard. It's more of a "do you use this language everyday" thing. I know I have gotten alot better from talking with friends, being corrected and I study just about everyday. :relief:

GaijinPunch

Mar 5, 2005, 04:42

Just learn the readings and meanings of each kanji seperately.

Does anyone know if this is the standard or not? I know to start out with, yeah, but almost all my latter lessons would usually only teach vocab (whether they be compound or not) it was up to the students to learn the kanji on it's own in the case the word was a compound.

Damicci

Mar 5, 2005, 04:51

kevinsano

Mar 6, 2005, 01:37

Hey, another Kevin.

Don't try combining them with meaing alone, that'll just confuse you even more. Dolphin(iruka), for example is an "Ocean Pig" in kanji.... And an idiot(baka) is a "Horse Deer".

GoldCoinLover

Mar 7, 2005, 04:05

Anywhere I have searched on learning kanji they teach you the readings seperately.
Then give examples of how it is used combined with other kanji. Eventually I noticed patterns when combining some kanji.

Ex.
学生　
中学
学校
All theses are related to schooling and gaku is the common reading.　No matter if the 学　Is before or after other kanji.

Ex.2
田中　Tanaka
山田　Yamada
Some kanji go into the second　゛　Pronounciation.　When listed after kanji but will maintain it's primary pronounciation when following hiragana。
If you know it's readings just looking at it can make sense.
Gets more complicated when using 3+ kanji
外国人　Gaikokujin
天国　Tengoku
日本人　Nihonjin
女の人　Onna no hito。
Does this make any sense?

Yes! Thank you. I'm moving to pheonix in 2 weeks, hopefully I can find a japanese place where I can buy flash cards! A bookstore where I live has a japanese dictionary and a very good book: "Japanese for dummies." I plan to save money up for colleage and take japanese classes. That would really help me prepare for my trip to tokyo in a few years. Hey that Nihonjin (Japanese person) makes alot of sense, because it has the kanji for person and the kanji for japan.

I've heard "hito" before, but I forgot what it means. What does "onna" mean?
And what about Tengoku?

Thank you!
:p

WHEATTHlNS

Mar 7, 2005, 12:47

Hito means person. . .Onna means Woman. . .

In my class both the MEANINGS and the READINGS are taught. . .it is expected for us to know all unfortunately - which if you ask me is a bit much.

As for a method to learning it all. . .shrugs - as my teacher said - "You just have to memorize it all. . ."

Brutal. . .

Damicci

Mar 7, 2005, 15:01

"You just have to memorize it all. . ."

Brutal. . .
Exactly

tengoku = paradise / heavenly land

ten -meaning heaven
goku - land

but yeah i know jplt lvl4 kanji and some lvl3 but i don't know all the readings for it i just know how to read them when they are grouped with certain kanji or hiragana

Index

Mar 7, 2005, 15:38

When you say combine, you mean a compound like 人口 ? You can't (always) think of it as "person mouth" as that makes absolutely no sense. In (I'd say) most cases, you really need to learn the vocabulary. There are some kanji that go together quite intuitively... but there are tons that don't.

It makes no sense if you are talking about "entrance" GaijinPunch, considering　it's　入口、not 人口. The first kanji means 'enter', not 'person'.

In a very general sense, when you have two kanji together you use the chinese readings, but when they are on their own you use the japanese reading. For example 新(しい） is atarashii on it's own, and 車 on it's own is kuruma, but when you put them together you get 新車 (shinsha). Another example is 時 (toki) and 間　(aida), resulting in 時間 (jikan) when together. Of course there are exceptions to this, and some kanji don't even have a chinese reading (as they are of Japanese origin).

Regarding flashcards, it's easier and much cheaper to make you own. Just print the kanji with your printer, with the reading on the back (takes a while to get the formatting down but it's quite straightforward), and then get it printed on cardboard and laminated at a printing shop. To cut them out get yourself a cheap guillotine.

PaulTB

Mar 7, 2005, 16:11

considering　it's　入口、not 人口. The first kanji means 'enter', not 'person'.
*ahem*
人口【じんこう】 (n) (1) population; (2) common talk; (P)
Sense 1 being by far the more common.

Index

Mar 7, 2005, 16:17

Yeah good point. My mistake, though for some reason I thought he was talking about entrance. My apologies GaijinPunch.

GaijinPunch

Mar 7, 2005, 21:36

Thank you PaulTB... Was about to make a link to goo. :) No apologies necessary, Index.