Is Japanese difficult?

[Meunier]

Could you tell me the level of difficulty of Japanese, assuming that my mother language is quite close to English? Especially, how does the writing system work?

[Uncle Frank]

pulling your bottom lip up over your head & ears & down to the back of your head. 3 alphabets, speech levels like to a friend,boss,or underling are different(levels of politeness). Male & female Japanese can be different. Different locations use different Japanese (kinda like accents). Plenty of non-Japanese speakers here show it can be done though. If you want help, this is the Forum to come to. If you just read old posts about language and look for some of the links to other sites to help you, it would be a good start.
To give you an idea, I'm not the brightest light bulb in the bunch. I lived in Japan for 2 years with Japanese friends and studied everyday. I never did get to learning Kanji to speak of. I couldn't follow radio or TV to well;understood 50% or less. It's the kind of thing you need a native speaker to listen to and practice with to get very far; a book or CD's alone make it difficult to do on your own I think. If you don't get to use it everyday, you forget things fast. But, I'm an old fart, so don't let me drag you down, YOU CAN DO IT, GO FOR IT !!

Frank

:blush:

[Gaijinian]

It is not actually that hard if you put your mind to it and study hard. But, it is not like European languages; most of the words sound nothing like English. Plus, there are 3 alphabets, one with nearly 2,000 regular use characters. Good luck.

[Ma Cherie]

Oh Frank you're so silly. :p But I would have to admit, Japanese isn't all that easy. Like any other language language it takes time and effort to learn. I hope you can get used to the idea of using verbs at the end of a sentence. :cool:

[Sensuikan San]

No language is easy.

Very few people are truly fluent in more than one tongue ... and many "bi-lingually brought up" folks are in that list!

But learning any language is fun! And even if you come away with just the ability to say "Yes", "No", Thank You" and "Bugger off!.... you're the better person.

Hang on in there and try it ...!

Best Regards,

ジョン

[Tsuyoiko]

It is hard, but your effort pays off - if you watch a Japanese film and can understand even a little bit, it makes it worthwhile. But you have to be patient. I have been learning for 6 months. When I started I thought I would know way more by now than I actually do. It is a very slow process. My best advice would be to practise EVERYDAY, because like Frank says, you soon forget. But you will have FUN!!!

:wave:

[Mike Cash]

The issue isn't so much a matter of how hard or easy it is. It's more a matter of your need for Japanese and your motivation and determination.

[Mycernius]

And even if you come away with just the ability to say "Yes", "No", Thank You" and "Bugger off!.... you're the better person.

I can do the "Yes", "No" and "Thank you", but I don't know "Bugger off"
I am currently trying to learn Japanese and finding some parts very easy (No gender for one) and others slightly harder (Kanji), but I am having fun learning it. I recently got into the habit of saying all my numbers in Japanese.

[Pachipro]

Mike Cash gave a very good answer and Frank gave you great advice.

For me, speaking Japanese was quite easy as soon as you understand the sentence structure and can use it easily. Of course, living there and having Japanese friends who don't speak English helps alot. The reading and writing is what intimidates most people. I mastered hiragana and katagana within a month or two. Kanji took a while. Even today I can still read way more kanji than I can write as writing takes practice and practice and practice in a little book filled with little squares where you write the same kanji over and over and over again. It takes time, patience, and practice.

Another funny thing (now that I think about it) is that today, since I don't use Japanese that often anymore, I can understand about 95% of what is spoken to me while my ability to speak is gradually decreasing.

Anyway, I would strongly suggest to anyone seriously interested in the learning the language to actually live there for at least a year. Easier said than done I know. An easier way is to find a Japanese girlfriend who speaks no or very limited English or a girlfriend/friend who can speak your language and is patient enough to teach you. And still you can enroll in a language school with a native Japanese teacher. It's much harder and you learn bad habits and pronunciation by trying it on your own. And yes I did take formal lessons for a couple of years. Even living there I didn't try to study on my own as I had too many questions that I needed explained.

[Matadon]

I'll second the 'practice, practice, practice' mantra. Every day, make it a point to read, write, speak, and listen, at least if you're serious about learning the language. You're going to come across vocab that doesn't seem like it matters at first ('Who the hell uses waribikiken[1]?!?'), but learn it anyway, because it will become surprisingly useful later on as you get better with the language.

Japanese IS difficult, especially with nuances that at first don't seem important (and that your instructors will gloss over). Buy a grammar guide and a good dictionary, and DIG whenever you come across something you don't understand.

Last tip: Unlike the anime freaks of the world, learn to speak POLITELY. Calling everyone "omae" or "kuso-yarou" isn't exactly the height of...social awareness[2]. Being nice will get you a hell of a lot farther than trying to sound like a macho idiot, especially if you don't have the bulk to back it up. *grin*

[1] Discount Coupon.

[2] There's a guy I know who is interested in learning Japanese, and who chats with me sometimes when I'm studying. He only knows a little bit, but talks like a macho anime character, and continuously wants to know how to say, how shall I put it, rather impolite phrases. *sigh*

[Gaijinian]

It seems like your going to put a lot of effort into it. It is worth it to see the looks of the Japanese peoples faces when you speak in Japanese to them. ^^
Oh, and use it a lot, and don't be afraid to mess up. 間違えなかったら全然習えないらしいんですよね。 Anyway, good luck, study hard.

[Matadon]

It seems like your going to put a lot of effort into it. It is worth it to see the looks of the Japanese peoples faces when you speak in Japanese to them. ^^
Oh, and use it a lot, and don't be afraid to mess up. 間違えなかったら全然習えないらしいんですよね。 Anyway, good luck, study hard.

その事は本当ですよ！いつも間違えて人が直させてると 新しいことを習うのが知っています。（さなみに間違い を見たら教えて下さい！）

でも、ガイジニアンが書いた事について質問が一つある ます。多分私ちゃんと分かれませんでしたが、説明して くれませんか？どうして「らしい」と書きました？「ら しい」は英語で「Ｉｔ　ｓｅｅｍｓ」か「Ｉ’ｖｅ　ｈ ｅａｒｄ　ｔｈａｔ」の意味があると思ったので、私は ちょっと分かりません。

ありがとう！

[Gaijinian]

いつも間違えて人が直させてると新しいことを習うのが 知っています。(さなみに間違いを見たら教えて下さい� I)

「その事」より、「そういう事」の方がいいかもしれま せんね。

その「直させる」の使用は、間違いかと思います。私の 自工紹介に同じみたいに「間違えたら直させてください 」と書いていたが、「意味はＡｌｌｏｗ　ｍｅ　ｔｏ　 ｃｏｒｒｅｃｔ」と教えられました。そう言いたい場合 、ただしい（漢字で書いたら、文字化けになってしまう ）ですけどね＾＾。
そして、書いてある「さなみ」は、「ちなみ」の誤り、 かな？
ニュアンスはちょっと違うが、私なら、こういいます＞ ＞そういう事は確かにそうですよ！いつも間違えて人は 直してくれると勉強になるのが分かってます。


でも、ガイジニアンが書いた事について質問が一つある ます。多分私ちゃんと分かれませんでした

間違いが2つありますね。最初は、やっぱりミスタイプ( I'm not sure if that's a word, but heh, it is now.w)でしょう。うっかり、「あるます」と書いてしま ったんですね。
次の方は、「分かる」といえば、「出来る」の意味が含 まれますね。「分かれる」の意味は、「別にする」なん ですね。

説明して くれませんか？どうして「らしい」と書きました？「ら しい」は英語で「It Seems」か「I've heard that」の意味があると思ったので、私はちょっと分かり ません。

説明は、言いたい事が、It seems that without making a mistake, one cannot learn.って。

別に、「らしい」の意味も「〜っぽい(~ish)」らしいｗ ですよ。 :-)

[m477]

I don't think there's anything inherently more difficult about Japanese as opposed to most other languages, but it will definitely take more work for a Westerner to learn Japanese as opposed to learning another Western language.

[Matadon]

ガイジンイアンさん：うまく説明してくれてありがとう ！もちろん「あるます」はタイッポ[1]でしたが、他の直しがとても便利でした。

ここで間違えがたくさんあるのでたくさん習ったかもし れませんね。実は５日に日本に行き、あそこでたくさん 間違う予定です。帰ってから、日本語がちょっとうまく なるといいんですが。。。

[1] ガイジンイアンさんは新しい言葉を作ったら私もそうし ます。(笑)

[Elizabeth]

間違いが2つありますね。最初は、やっぱりミスタイプ( I'm not sure if that's a word, but heh, it is now.w)でしょう。
はい、「ミスタイプ」という言い方も少しおかしいと思 います。
英語を日本語に直訳したような言葉ですね。:p :bluush:

ケアレスミスやタイプミス？でいいと思います。

単純なタイプミスなのか本当に文法や用法を間違ってい るのか
よくわからないので、ここで、私は訂正しないこともあ りますよ。 :relief:

[Sensuikan San]

I can do the "Yes", "No" and "Thank you", but I don't know "Bugger off"


I think I do .... :biggrin:

And .... as I have just posted on another thread ... try this for the source ...

http://www.intercom.net/user/logan1/jap.htm

...I'm in the construction industry, OK? - You need this stuff....!

ジョン :beer:

[Shisu]

I think it's pretty difficult. My mother tounge is Swedish, so pretty close to English in grammar and lots of words...
But I am lucky though. I don't think I would get far from studying myself through books and things like that (I seldom learn good that way) but for four months ago, I got a Japanese boyfriend, who came here 10 months ago. So now, I'm learning faster, mostly to listen to him and the way he speaks English and Swedish (trust me, I find Japanese patterns in it!)
My suggestion; get a japanese friend through internet or better, if possible, in real life, try to get japanese anime or other programs subbed in your language or english, borrow books at your library etc. That's how I do it.. ^^

Good luck! *Ganbatte kudasai!*

[Elizabeth]

It is hard, but your effort pays off - if you watch a Japanese film and can understand even a little bit, it makes it worthwhile. But you have to be patient. I have been learning for 6 months. When I started I thought I would know way more by now than I actually do. It is a very slow process. My best advice would be to practise EVERYDAY, because like Frank says, you soon forget. But you will have FUN!!!

:wave:
That's fabulous that anyone can understand even scraps of film dialogue after just six months. Things like news radio and basic conversation without I can get without much of a problem, but really casual or fast speech is a never-ending nigate. :bluush:

それが出来てから口語的な砕けた言い方を使うべきです ね。:p

[Damicci]

Ｂａｈ　Ｊａｐａｎｅｓｅ　ｓｕｃｋｓ．　:p
But if you want to learn it you will.
Somehow I am still learning it.

[Elizabeth]

そんな感じですね。:okashii: 　普通の日常会話を理解するには、とてもよい勉強にな ると思います。

でも、はじめは意味が分からなくてもやっぱり、日本人 と話したり、テレビや ビデオを見たりしているうちにだんだんと分かるように なると思います。心配しなくてもいいですよ。 :p 　
みなさんがんばって！

[studyonline]

Japanese is difficult! I am glad I am a native speaker of the language. I admire all of you! I can't imagine things you need to go through...

習うより慣れろ is the key.

[Gaijinian]

Even for a 日系 not in Japan it must be hard. You've gotta' learn to read and write...

[AhmedHan]

I am Turkish; and Nihonga is very close to my mother language. Its sentences structure is very familiar. It is not difficult to learn for a Turkish person.

iyi (jp) = iyi (tr)
desu = dir
ka = mi

But, I heard that it is difficult for an English person. On the other hand, a great number of words in Nihongo is imported from English.

batta = butter
naifu = knife
kohi = coffee

[Tsuyoiko]

That's fabulous that anyone can understand even scraps of film dialogue after just six months. Things like news radio and basic conversation without I can get without much of a problem, but really casual or fast speech is a never-ending nigate. :bluush:

それが出来てから口語的な砕けた言い方を使うべきです ね。:p

Thanks Elizabeth! They are scraps though. The longest thing I have understood is a conversation about the time. It was like "What time is it?" "4 o'clock" "In the morning?" "Yes, morning". I nearly threw a party when I understood all that!

[Rich303]

An easier way is to find a Japanese girlfriend who speaks no or very limited English or a girlfriend/friend who can speak your language and is patient enough to teach you. And still you can enroll in a language school with a native Japanese teacher. It's much harder and you learn bad habits and pronunciation by trying it on your own. And yes I did take formal lessons for a couple of years. Even living there I didn't try to study on my own as I had too many questions that I needed explained.

I've not been finding this very easy either!
I've been using JFriends for a while and I've just been getting interest from Russian women, even though my profile says I want to make a Japanese friend to help with my japanese.I've been learning some stuff from work mates,but it's not always the best time. My pen friend has helped a little too, although she didn't seem very interested in my japanese skills when we met in May.
Hearing japanese spoken a lot is definately a big help,though.

At least I've mastered my first particle, 'no'- which is a start.

There are so many ways to say goodbye in japanese, but I suppose this is the same with many languages.

So far I've learnt; Mata ne, Osaki, Mata ashita ne(see you tomorrow), Sayonara, Shitsurei shimasu (more excuse me), Otsukare sama deshita...

I will keep trying.

- Rich303 (Russian babe magnet)


P.S Does anyone know how to say 'Sorry I cannot afford to pay for you and your extended family to live in England' - in Russian?

[Tsuyoiko]

You forgot 'bai bai'!

[Rich303]

You forgot 'bai bai'!

Cheers!
How did I forget that one? - that's the easiest of them all...