Joyo Poster?

[E-Arkham]

You know what I think might be a nice reference? A wall poster with all 1945 Joyo kanji, their main meaning in English, and both くんよみ and おんよみ. Perhaps the most common meaning and most common readings only, since even at wall size space might be tight. Or even limit it to the 1000 most common kanji.

Something like this on my office wall would be extremely handy. I tried google, eBay, etc. Anyone know if anyone makes these? Closest I can find are Japanese school kanji, arranged by grade per kanji and selling for a whopping $12 a piece (ouch)... Nevermind the fact that I don't have enough wall space for that many posters.

Kep

[dc_johnson45]

You know what I think might be a nice reference? A wall poster with all 1945 Joyo kanji, their main meaning in English, and both くんよみ and おんよみ. Perhaps the most common meaning and most common readings only, since even at wall size space might be tight. Or even limit it to the 1000 most common kanji.

Something like this on my office wall would be extremely handy. I tried google, eBay, etc. Anyone know if anyone makes these? Closest I can find are Japanese school kanji, arranged by grade per kanji and selling for a whopping $12 a piece (ouch)... Nevermind the fact that I don't have enough wall space for that many posters.

Kep
How the heck would you fit all that on a poster?!? Why not just buy the grade level posters (skip grade one) & just replace them as you learn them? Besides, it wouldn't be a great learning tool.... rather overwhelming I would think. And how would you find a particular kanji?

I don't mean to be overly critical, but there is probably a reason that no one makes one :giggle:

[E-Arkham]

Flooding myself with information is one of the best ways that I learn. I didn't even consider that it probably doesn't work for others. <g>

The idea is that as I walk into or out of the room, I glance at the poster, pick a handful and "replay" them in my head over and over as I refresh my tea, eat, read the newspaper, fiddle with projects in the workshop, etc, etc.

All of them could easily fit on a poster... the size constraint is mostly based on balancing how large each is/how easy to read at a distance.

Ah well. I'll probably just make my own anyway (maybe not poster sized, but many regular sheets, heh). That might be for the best since I'd have to review all of them as I print them out.

Kep

[Gaijinian]

That'd be a big poster...

[lexico]

Here's a touyou kanji jitai hyou (http://www.aozora.gr.jp/kanji_table/touyoukanji_jitaihyou/) and touyou kanji hyou (http://www.aozora.gr.jp/kanji_table/touyoukanji_hyou/). It also has the 常用, 教育, 人名, and comparison chart. I believe you can also download the big charts, too. :-)

[epigene]

Hope this one helps:

常用漢字表 (http://www.taishukan.co.jp/kanji/archive/joyokanji.html)

:wave:

[Gaijinian]

This is random, but 常用漢字表 is fun to say. :)

[E-Arkham]

I think those links will be quite helpful. ありがとうございます！

Kep

[NovaTeacher]

I agree, if you don't have something grabbing your attention (like on your wall), it's easy to forget to study for days or weeks.

I have a chart on my wall which graphs my results for kanji tests.
This motivates me to test myself on new kanji, better my average score and most importantly just to continue the line on the graph.

[ishnar]

try http://www.jbox.com/STUDYAIDS/

The very first item sounds like what you want.

Ishnar

[E-Arkham]

Yeah, wow, that's perfect! ありがとう！

Kep

[Vortex]

There's also this kanji poster with all 1945 joyo kanji at the website for White Rabbit Press. It looks big but really nice! And it has the ON and KUN readings too.

[Putrefaction]

常用漢字表
Joyo Kanji omote? Or is it Joyo Kanji Hyo? I've also seen Joyo Kanji spelt
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v178/Xtremevillan/Japanese/IMG_0026.jpg?t=1232122952
Somehow I can't find the actual character Kanji for them on Wikipedia.
Well never mind I found it; 要 I had to search yō...and the definition on Wiki is not close to the one given in my book. (book: main point, wiki: need)

[Mycernius]

I've got that book as well. I have two really because I thought I lost one. I should really sort out my bookshelves.

[nekojita]

要 I had to search yō...and the definition on Wiki is not close to the one given in my book. (book: main point, wiki: need)
There's a good reason for that:
必要 = necessary, needed, essential
要る = to need
but also
要因 = main factor, main cause
主要 = chief/principal/major/main, etc.

In this case:
肝要 "essential, vital".
(and sure enough, the English title of that book is "Essential Kanji")

[Putrefaction]

If I may try to name them:
必要 = hitsuyo
要る = yosuru
I didn't learn the second kanji in your third example
主要 = shuyo?

Hm.

[nekojita]

要る = iru (you're thinking perhaps of 要する)
要因 = youin

[Putrefaction]

Ah, thanks very much. I was indeed thinking of that.

[Toritoribe]

It already announced that 文化審議会[ぶんかしんぎかい: Council for Cultural Affairs] will reform 常用漢字[じょうようかんじ] next year, a tentative plan now - add 191 characters, delete 5.
So, New 常用漢字 will be 2131...

[Putrefaction]

Oh god damn it!

[Glenn]

It already announced that 文化審議会[ぶんかしんぎかい: Council for Cultural Affairs] will reform 常用漢字[じょうようかんじ] next year, a tentative plan now - add 191 characters, delete 5.
So, New 常用漢字 will be 2131...

Right on. They could probably do with adding more, too, if you ask me.

By the way, 要 can also be read かなめ, and means the main part or something along those lines.

例：空軍力がその国の軍事政策の要となっている。
れい：くうぐんりょくが　その　くにの　ぐんじせいさくの　かなめと　なっている。
Example: The focal point of that country's military policy is air force power. (must be Israel...)

Also, xtremevillan, I strongly urge you to make it a point to get the vowels right -- 必要 is hitsuyou/hitsuyô, 要する is yousuru/yôsuru, 主要 is shuyou/shuyô, etc.

[Putrefaction]

I never did get those, with the extra vowels. I'll try to do that but it just looks weird...plus I always pronounce it wrong, I pronounce Mei as me and then an I, not a continuation of an e...but that's my error, lol.

Also come on! We already have to memorize 2000...now it's 2150!

[Glenn]

I'm already at or beyond that anyway, so it doesn't bother me. Granted, I'm not going to claim that I've completely mastered them all (or any of them, really), but seeing things like 台頭 and wondering what the hell that's supposed to mean, finding out, and then wondering why the hell it's written that way is confusing, especially when it could have just been written 擡頭, like it was intended to be, and all I would have had to do was learn one more character with a meaning that makes sense in the compound. I'd also prefer 繁盛 to be written 繁昌, because it just makes more sense that way to me, if not from a meaning standpoint, then at least from a reading standpoint. I get the impression that these aren't isolated incidents because I remember running across a few other words like them, I just can't think of them atm. But perhaps I'm a bit biased.

[Putrefaction]

I see dai, meaning a stand. The rest, I have no clue, except for the two suns meaning risk? (thank you RTK lol, from the ones that I did look at)

[Glenn]

No, the two suns was "prosperous;" "risk" is eyes looking up at the sun: 冒.

[Putrefaction]

Oh...oh yeah, blah...oh on some unrelated news, I've been doubling back on the ~360 I've learned, going over the On and kun (especially kun, as a lot of them are verbs). I forgot a LOT, especially how to write them.

[Glenn]

It already announced that 文化審議会[ぶんかしんぎかい: Council for Cultural Affairs] will reform 常用漢字[じょうようかんじ] next year, a tentative plan now - add 191 characters, delete 5.
So, New 常用漢字 will be 2131...

More on this that I wanted to hit upon: I suppose this isn't the case, but I'll ask anyway -- are they going to also stop pretending like anything outside the list doesn't exist for newspapers and such (I know they sort of ignore that anyway, but 覚せい剤 seems to be the legal and only acceptable way to write 覚せい剤取締法 (http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%A6%9A%E3%81%9B%E3%81%84%E5%89%A4))? う回 for 迂回, 急きょ for 急遽, えい船 for 曳船, 危ぐ for 危惧, おう吐 for 嘔吐, etc. just bother me. So does 覚せい剤 for 覚醒剤, by the way (and 改ざん for 改竄 and ねつ造 for 捏造... OK, I think that's all of them). I may be way outside of common opinion on this, though.

The other thing was just something I'm wondering about the ones that are being taken off. I'm guessing 匁 is one of them, and although it seems like I had more in mind when I started typing this, I can't remember any of them and can't think of any more (well, 逓 and 迭 come to mind).

[Toritoribe]

More on this that I wanted to hit upon: I suppose this isn't the case, but I'll ask anyway -- are they going to also stop pretending like anything outside the list doesn't exist for newspapers and such (I know they sort of ignore that anyway, but 覚せい剤 seems to be the legal and only acceptable way to write 覚せい剤取締法 (http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%A6%9A%E3%81%9B%E3%81%84%E5%89%A4))? う回 for 迂回, 急きょ for 急遽, えい船 for 曳船, 危ぐ for 危惧, おう吐 for 嘔吐, etc. just bother me. So does 覚せい剤 for 覚醒剤, by the way (and 改ざん for 改竄 and ねつ造 for 捏造... OK, I think that's all of them). I may be way outside of common opinion on this, though.
It's silly but that "ugliness" on writings will remain...

the list of 191 kanji
http://i43.tinypic.com/2zi4y8j.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/mcwxvs.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/25a3nrb.jpg

So you will be able to see at least 危惧 and 覚醒剤 on a newspaper.:relief:

The other thing was just something I'm wondering about the ones that are being taken off. I'm guessing 匁 is one of them, and although it seems like I had more in mind when I started typing this, I can't remember any of them and can't think of any more (well, 逓 and 迭 come to mind). I may be way outside of common opinion on this, though.
Bingo! 匁 is in it. The others are 銑 錘 勺 脹.

[Putrefaction]

Oh wait I know one of them that is being added...that can't be though...the last row, fifth one to the right, ro: isn't that vertebrae or spine or something? I remember it from heisig.2nd to last row, 4th one over, isn't that like law or something?

[Glenn]

It's silly but that "ugliness" on writings will remain...

the list of 191 kanji
http://i43.tinypic.com/2zi4y8j.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/mcwxvs.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/25a3nrb.jpg

I'm pretty shocked to see that a LOT of these aren't currently on the 常用漢字表. I see them often, and learned them under the pretense that they were, actually. I knew 俺 and 誰 weren't, and I always thought that was ridiculous.

So you will be able to see at least 危惧 and 覚醒剤 on a newspaper.:relief:

...and 破綻 and 剥奪 and 鬱憤 and 鬱病 and 失踪 and 比喩 and 旺盛 and 謙遜 and 骸骨... 捻挫、嫉妬、取り沙汰、曖昧、咽喉、挨拶、親戚、脊椎 動物、椎茸 (yummy)、美貌、全貌・・・ Oh yeah, this opens up a lot of words. No 抽籤 though. :(

Heh, I'm a nerd.


Bingo! 匁 is in it. The others are 銑 錘 勺 脹.

匁 was always my example for a character that should not be on the list. I can't recall having ever seen 銑 outside of studying it, so that one makes sense. The other two I'm ambiguous about.

[Glenn]

Oh wait I know one of them that is being added...that can't be though...the last row, fifth one to the right, ro: isn't that vertebrae or spine or something? I remember it from heisig.2nd to last row, 4th one over, isn't that like law or something?

呂 does have the keyword "spine" in Heisig. 冶 ("metallurgy"), however, isn't in the first book (it's in the third one), and the keyword was "reign," not "law." The character you're thinking of is 治. The difference is "ice" (冶) vs. "water" (治). However, if you're studying simplified Chinese, they're treated as the same character (冶 is used for 治), I believe, which is another reason simplified Chinese sucks.

By the way, 治 is read チ, ジ, なお・る, なお・す, おさ・まる, おさ・める, and 冶 is read ヤ.

[Putrefaction]

Thank you for the clarification!

[Toritoribe]

I'm pretty shocked to see that a LOT of these aren't currently on the 常用漢字表. I see them often, and learned them under the pretense that they were, actually. I knew 俺 and 誰 weren't, and I always thought that was ridiculous.
Yeah, probably most of all native speakers will have same impression. 岡 is not 常用漢字?! So where's 岡山県?! Actually, they say that's one of the reasons 茨城, 愛媛, 熊本, 埼玉, 栃木, 奈良, 大阪, 岐阜 are in the list.

Heh, I'm a nerd.
might be...:p

[Glenn]

Yeah, probably most of all native speakers will have same impression. 岡 is not 常用漢字?! So where's 岡山県?! Actually, they say that's one of the reasons 茨城, 愛媛, 熊本, 埼玉, 栃木, 奈良, 大阪, 岐阜 are in the list.

That almost makes too much sense! haha I was noticing that, too. They always seem to be written with their kanji anyway, though. I suppose さいたま市 is going to stay like that though.
might be...:p
That's why the chicks dig me. lmao

One more thing I thought of: will 理窟 become official again? Probably not, eh? I've actually kind of gotten used to writing it that way. :/

[AMIGO]

I've been having a look to the list and I was take aback. I've seen that I know 73 kanjis from those 191 new kanji. In fact there are a lot that (foreign) students would know very well.
Besides those that Glenn posted (俺 and　誰) there are for example:
諦める
羨ましい
挨拶！！
秘密！！
箸 (cultural importance)
肘
膝
脇
虹 (beautiful meaning)
謎
嵐
宛 (for letters)
熊
鶴
鹿。。。
I've known 嵐 for 4 years! when I were starting intermediate grammar.

btw, there are some Kanji that I would add:
How about...?
惚れる
鼠
這う
癌　「これはごめんね」。。。

[Glenn]

Yeah, 嵐, 鶴, 鹿, 虎, 熊, and 羨 all surprised me too. I agree with the 4 you mentioned, especially since 惚れる is pretty much along the same lines as 憧れる (and is used in 己惚れる). We also get 刹那 and 旦那.

You have the wrong ミツ, though. It's not 秘密のミツ, it's 蜂蜜のミツ. There's a 虫 in the place of the 山.

[AMIGO]

You have the wrong ミツ, though. It's not 秘密のミツ, it's 蜂蜜のミツ. There's a 虫 in the place of the 山.

Ops, it's true. They are so similar. I wish I had your skill to make them out. :bluush:

[Toritoribe]

One more thing I thought of: will 理窟 become official again? Probably not, eh?
Yeah, probably not. Unfortunately, 理屈 is already widespread. 窟 might be for e.g. 岩窟.

文化庁[Agency for Cultural Affairs] will solicit public opinions regarding this tentative plan on the HP in March. So both of you, or anyone else, can post your opinions.;-)

[Glenn]

Yeah, probably not. Unfortunately, 理屈 is already widespread. 窟 might be for e.g. 岩窟.

洞窟 is safe, though. :-)

文化庁[Agency for Cultural Affairs] will solicit public opinions regarding this tentative plan on the HP in March. So both of you, or anyone else, can post your opinions.;-)

Now that's pretty cool. I just found the page where they announced it (http://www.bunka.go.jp/kokugo_nihongo/bunkasingi/kanji_29/gijishidai.html), too. I'm still rummaging around looking for the 世論調査情報.