I need a kick up the backside

[violetcrumble]

I have all the resources; books, cds, videos, TV doramas, comics.
My kanji cards are all printed out, stacked neatly and labled.
I have my study timetable pinned up on my wall,
a regular language exchange once a week,
and all the learning videos lined up ready to go.
I live in Japan, and
I even went and got myself a Japanese boyfriend.

But that's it.

I have everything prepared and ready, but I don't do anything with it. Well, not much anyway. I have been through phases where I will study my textbook, memorise, and practice using the dialog, and then forget about it for a couple of months. Then for a few weeks I'll do "Remembering th Kanji", and everything is going great until I stop and the cards gather dust and clutter up my table. Same with the videos, pimsleur cd, and all the rest of my great study technique ideas which I always started excitingly thinking it was the solution to my study slump.

Why can't I stick with it? I've been dragging out my studying for 2 years now and I am barely above beginner level. When I actually start studying, I have no problems. Nothing will distract me. But I just can't seem to make myself sit down everyday and do it.

Am I the World's Biggest Procrastinator?

[Mike Cash]

Actually, you're fairly typical.

[yorkii]

its like going to the gym. people buy loads of equipment or buy an expensive membership to the gym but never use it. because studying is not as easy as sitting on the internet chatting to friends or watching movies, people avoid it. i know i do too.

you think... "i had a hard time at work today, i deserve a rest. i won't study" then the next day...

"what did i do last night? I could have studied in those hours i spen doing nothing really very interesting or important."

thats what happens to me anyway.

u live in Japan, so it should be more of a motivation for you to study. i know it is for me. I want to look lazy in the Japanese peoples eyes and want to show that i am willing to put the effort in to learn thier language. Also, to watch tv, read signs, hold a decent conversation with people, make friends, and so on and so on... i think learning the language is really important tolearn while living here.

[Kinsao]

As you live in Japan, maybe you can do some of your learning in a way that relates directly into your daily life? That's what I'd try to do if I was in your place.
Learn phrases that you'll use when you're going about your normal business, like, in shopping, dealing with tradesmen, using public transport, going to work, striking up a conversation... whatever it is that you do. ^^ Get your boyfriend to teach you phrases - I mean useful ones! XD - like, when you are just living normally, you ask, 'how do I say that in Japanese?' and stuff like that... I used to do that, and that way you learn some practical things (like on a walk I would spot something and ask the word in Japanese and that would usually make me think of an associated phrase/sentence and I would also ask what that is in Japanese and hence I would keep learning... ^^).

If you talk to as many people in Japanese as possible, that should be helpful... I guess like in any foreign country people might be inclined to speak English to you if they know it, but also some people are bound to be pleased that you are making the effort to learn their language... and that's good for making friends too. ^^

Also, for kanji, you can learn some of the ones you see most commonly, in your daily business... or you can make a resolve to learn one new one each day, or 2 days, and simply pick one at random off a news paper or something and learn it! =P But I guess it's useful, isn't it, to learn the ones you see often, like on signs in shops, train station etc. You probably know a lot of these already, but there are always more difficult ones to move onto! =P

Good luck in your learning! ^^

(PS. This thread caught my attention because it popped up to the top after Mike's post with the intriguing tag "I need a kick up the backside by Mike Cash". :lol: )

[epigene]

I found the title very intriguing, too! :blush:

I agree with Mike that this happens for many people. That's why the few who have the determination to make progress and actually do deserve respect and admiration.

If you live in Japan and have a Japanese boyfriend but feel you're not making progress, maybe your boyfriend is practicing his English on you rather than the other way around? Maybe his English is too good, that you instinctively depend on him?

Most likely, you need to make a deliberate effort to place yourself in a situation where you must use Japanese to get by and tell your boyfriend (and all other people around you) not to use English (or your native language) on you. Immersion is a very effective way of learning a language.

Hope it helps! :wave:

[violetcrumble]

You guys have just about figured me out!
So in response in no particular order:

- I already know enough Japanese to handle daily living, shopping, trains etc. Plus I can have a very *very* basic conversation. I just can't get past that level.

- my boyfriend does try to force me to use Japanese but it just doesn't work. He's talking in Japanese, I get a headache and stop paying attention. On our "Japan only" days, it just ends up with us not saying anything much at all.

- my job is 100% English, even Japanese office staff speak English to each other. (But that's no excuse because some of my coworkers are JLPTlevel1)

- I am really really good at making excuses - exactly what Yorkii said

- when I do speak Japanese, I feel embarrassed, get tongue-tied, and then really annoyed when people laugh and say how cute I am.

I think I just gotta either give up or just quit whinging and actually do it. I'm tired of feeling guilty everyday.

Okay that's it! I'm off to study knaji right now! Right this very second! I swear I am....:bravo:

[Mike Cash]

I don't think I made a hell of a lot of progress until I took the plunge and entered a 100% Japanese-only work environment. Very much the old "sink-or-swim" school. When the rent and the groceries are at stake, one views language acquisition in an entirely different light.

As for feeling embarassed and/or getting tongue-tied....that's also typical. And it can go on for quite a while, especially if you are in a mixed-language environment.

[epigene]

- when I do speak Japanese, I feel embarrassed, get tongue-tied, and then really annoyed when people laugh and say how cute I am.
Keep on being cute, violetcrumble!

You know, the Japanese (including me) really find foreigners who are trying their best to speak Japanese charming. They're not laughing at you. :cool:

[Elizabeth]

I think I just gotta either give up or just quit whinging and actually do it. I'm tired of feeling guilty everyday.
Find a reason you really want to learn as opposed to feeling guilty or embarrased not to know more by this point. Try to motivate yourself from the desire to do something positive and there's absolutely no reason you won't be able to accomplish it ! :cheer: :relief:

[Bucko]

Almost two years ago I met a Japanese girl who had that whole "Japan is superior", "Japanese is the world's most difficult language", air about her and said it would take me (or any other foreigner) 10 years to reach a low-intermediate level. I have also met a few other Japanese who have this attitude and it absolutely delights me to prove them wrong. This is basically my main motivation. I've been studing for a little over a year now and have reached that low-intermediate level that was once suggested would take 10 years.

[Elizabeth]

I've always wanted to do it mostly for thrill of accomplishing something hugely difficult (sorry Bucko :)), love of the culture and because I felt a powerful need for change in my life.

But I also always had the terrible attitude of not wanting to try speaking or writing until it was darn near natural perfection. it wasn't until I was in jeopardy of being dumped and all the Japanese people I knew started avoiding me that I decided to throw caution to the wind and let them know what I knew regardless of how stupid it may have sounded at the time. I can't say the rest is history yet, but things have just sort of snowballed from there. :-)

[Bucko]

I've always wanted to do it mostly for thrill of accomplishing something hugely difficult (sorry Bucko :)), love of the culture and because I felt a powerful need for change in my life.

Hehe, I didn't mean that I don't find it hard, of course it's hard! But not impossibile, which is what some have tried to lead me to believe. Anyway, I think I'll revise what I said about that being my main motivation, I was just trying to fire up the OP! The more I study Japanese the more interesting it gets. In some ways it's very close to English, and in others it's completely different. I find these similarities and differences really interesting. But how long's it going to be until I can actually read a decent Japanese book? I'm guessing at least another year. Elizabeth, how good are you at actually reading Japanese books? I'm talking everyday novels, reference books etc.

[Mycernius]

You're not the only one. I'm much the same. Plus there aren't that many Japanese speakers in my area of the UK. But I will persevere at it

[yukio_michael]

When I lived in Japan, my girlfriend's English was better than my Japanese, even though she told me I was the only person with whom she could communicate in English with... we mostly practiced her English, and I helped her study for Nova, but when she taught me Japanese, it was sometimes the names of SMAP members, or the word for female ninja, which I told her wouldn't do me much good at all...

...I wanted to learn what was being said entirely to me when I went to go shop at the 99en store, or at Lawson... When she corrected me in public, I became more embarassed, even though I knew, that my use of Japanse was not seen as funny or silly to Japanese.... that my effort counted too.

When I was there, with more materials than I have now, I never studied, I watched plenty of television, but I felt like my life was transitive, she was an idealist and wanted to mary, I didn't just yet... I expected the wosrt, got worse than that...

Now both of us are out of Japan, still speaking, working our way back to each other, she doesn't speaks English much, never practices ever, as she lives with her sister, in New York, I live a few hours away in Pennslyvania... money keeps us apart... I study every day, mostly, though, I feel I'll be studying even more as I've just joined a local language group and I'm moving into my own room w/ a desk I can study at...

Sometimes Japanese feels like an excercise in futility to me... my want to know it is rooted in my desire to, even casually, by understanding, belong to something by understanding it--- where so few others do... to be able to speak to my girlfriend naturally, even though she aims to learn English, one day, she says...

The Japanese language meetings are the best thing, as they put me in contact with native speakers, for which reading and speaking Japanese becomes again something to which I can work on and practice... I think as was said, you have to force yourself into these situations, as it's just too easy to be alowed to avoid them.

I wish, before, in Japan I had somehow learned to stomach the fear of feeling embarassed or awkward in my speach... I had read more than too much about Japan's lack of interest in outsiders, and I felt probably moreso like one...

Some days I feel like I am making progress, other days it feels like I am a thousand years off of common litteracy.

[jonny-mt]

violet, I think everybody here has been through or will go through that stage at some point or another. In the end, the only one who can give you the kick in the backside is you. If you really feel you're stagnating, why not try and find out about Japanese lessons in your city? Or get out there and join a club, try your hand at calligraphy or ikebana?
As far as personal anecdotes go, I've been very fortunate to get several such well-needed kicks. Probably the biggest one was when I studied in Kyoto during my third year of college and lived with a homestay family. My Japanese was terribly broken when I arrived and, like you, I would get tired of communicating in it after thirty minutes or so. But my life basically depended on it, and so I simply stuck it out. Intensive language study at school combined with immersion at home pushed my boundaries exstensively. Yes, I had good Japanese days and bad Japanese days (I still have bad Japanese days), but using the brute force approach worked in the end, and my language skills improved remarkably.
Yes, you can say to yourself, "Man, I could sit down and do this!" and it might work for a day or it might work for years (one kid at my current...er, soon to be former...language program learned Japanese because a friend bet him he couldn't). But the people who can do that are the exception--the rest of us have to find external motivations at the least or make it a do-or-die situation at the most extreme. Your college GPA depends on it, your salary depends on it, your lifestyle depends on it. If you can figure out what you are willing to risk to obtain the Japanese you want and place your bet, there will be no stopping you.

[Mars Man]

All good comments and posts there. . . I can add absolutely nothing new. But I just thought, hey, violetcrumble san, I basically did the same thing with the Kanji learning while going in for speaking more--but not really studying on it that much at all. Everytime I get another sheet of paper from the administration office or the Job Hunting Service office, I really, really wish I had kept up that Kanji studying I had been so keen on doing back when I first settled down into this area.

I wish you the best of luck; and never forget that we are all here to help out in the various ways that we can ! We are all cheering for you !! MM

[Thunderthief]

I force myself to study several hours every night even if im not up to it. Im a slow learner so dragging my feet it would probably take me a decade to learn it, which is why I don't.

Being the bubling idiot I am its probably going to take me near 5 years to get at a reasonable level of speaking, reading and writing... But I don't let it get to me because I have nothing better to do in my free time besides playing video games.

*is a GED highschool dropout kid studying japanese*

so don't feel bad

[Pachipro]

Some very good suggestions and obversations posted. I think that since you are in an English speaking environment at work and know the basics of Japanese to get through your daily routine and lifestyle that maybe you are thinking, "Why bother. I can get through my day just fine and I'll do it tomorrow or next week." The only thing is that tomorrow or next week never comes.

Learning a language by ones self is almost downright impossible unless you really have the desire and will power to see it through. Maybe you should try taking a Japanese language class and pay for it yourself in order to improve your knowledge of the language. When it is coming out of your own pocket, one usually has incentive to learn.

It worked for me when I was living in Japan and knew enough to hold a decent conversation, write my name and address, and read fairly well, but wanted to advance myself further in the language. It may just work for you.

[Thunderthief]

Living in the United States makes it particularly hard to learn Japanese because there is no exposure, you have to create it. This can be done by watching Japanese movies with no subtitles and playing Japanese video games.