Princess Masako

[Elizabeth van Kampen]

I am reading a book called :"Prinzessin Masako, Der gefangene Schmetterling"
That is "Princess Masako, the captived butterfly"I guess.
The book is written by Yoko Kobayashi and Martin Fritz.

What a tragedy, I feel sorry for the Japanese crown prince and for the princess Masako.
The book gives me a very special look into the Japanese empire.
I know that our Dutch queen Beatrix has a very special friendship bond with the Japanese royal family. I also read somewhere that prince Nahurito and princess Masako will visit the Netherlands in August, but incognito. I suppose that they stay as guests from our queen or they stay with our prince Alexander and Maxima. So they will have some rest and peaceful time together.

What do most of the Japanese people, especialy the young Japanese, think of the Japanese royal family? Should it be less strickt and more up to a modern way of living, or does the emperor and the other members of his family have to live in an oldfashioned cage, forever??
Are many Japanese still really interested in the emperor and his family?

[Dutch Baka]

My mom is actually reading the same book, and is very interested in her.

She is indeed coming to the Netherlands for I think 2 weeks in the middle of August. ( my mom wants to pick her up from the airport I think hahaha)

My wife ( Japanese ) is interested in it, and she follows the news about them, as she follows the news about Brad Pitt. And I think most japanese read about them　now and then and have an interest in them, but only as a Cultural status.

[budd]

romance is one thing. reality is quite another

[changedonrequest]

romance is one thing. reality is quite another

It's great when the two join, but in this case and in the case of the Crown Prince's mother reality has been a major shock.

[GodEmperorLeto]

What exactly is going on with the Imperial couple? I heard that the princess can't have children and that has made the issue really difficult, especially when it comes to succession.

[changedonrequest]

What exactly is going on with the Imperial couple? I heard that the princess can't have children and that has made the issue really difficult, especially when it comes to succession.

There was a serious discussion in the Japanese Diet about this issue, as all the current members of the Imperial Family after the Crown Prince are females.

The Crown Prince's brother's wife is pregnant and everyone is waiting to see if she gives birth to a girl or not.

If she does give birth to a girl it is very possible that the Diet will make a law stating that the succession will be based upon the birth of the first born child, whether it be a boy or girl.

However if she gives birth to a boy the succession would go from the current Crown Prince to his nephew, unless of course he and Masako-sama are able to have another child and it would be a boy.

Personally since it is the 21st Century and there have been Japanese Empresses before, the law should be changed either way to the first born child regardless of sex. That is my opinion of course.

[ricecake]

Personally since it is the 21st Century and there have been Japanese Empresses before,the law should be changed either way to the first born child regardless of sex.



8 Japanese Empresses with 2 reigned twice according to my book " Chronology of Japan's Royal House ".

[Glenn]

I thought the issue wasn't so much that there would be an empress as it was that the family line would cease to be followed through the males' lineage. It would break the imperial family line to switch midstream like that.

[GodEmperorLeto]

I thought the issue wasn't so much that there would be an empress as it was that the family line would cease to be followed through the males' lineage. It would break the imperial family line to switch midstream like that.
Actually, the purity of blood is more guaranteed if the succession is matrilineal (i.e. through females). Without modern DNA testing, you can never be absolutely certain of who the father is. That's why pharaohs of Egypt had to marry their sisters (ewwww), and some Semitic cultures trace descent matrilineally (like the Jews).

[Glenn]

Except that doesn't matter when the Japanese imperial family has been patrileneal for over a millennium. Accurate or not, it's how they do it. Switching over would be a certain way to break the line.

[gaijin_girl]

Hm...I can see how being unable to reproduce would be a problem, but the royal family should really lighten up on Princess Masako. She may not be royalty but she shouldn't have to be smothered.

[caster51]

I want to see aiko sama as a Emperor.
however I dont want to see aiko's child as a next Emperor.
aiko is a last emperor of Hirohito line.
if aiko's son will be a candidacy as a Emperor, I dont want to keep the Imperial household in Japan.

[changedonrequest]

I want to see aiko sama as a Emperor.
however I dont want to see aiko's child as a next Emperor.
aiko is a last emperor of Hirohito line.

Caster if Aiko-sama became Emperess and she had a child, male or female, could you explain why she would be the last of the Hirohito line?

Wouldn't her child have direct blood-ties through her father?

[caster51]

Wouldn't her child have direct blood-ties through her father?
blood is nothing.
it is a just to keep the Imperial household.
however this Imperial household will change a different dynasty in other ppl's man in line.
you have a father of great ancester in anciest.
you and a father of your great ancester is connecting completly with one male line
however aiko and next Emperor is cut in male line
it means it changes new dynasty

[epigene]

FYI:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_Imperial_succession_controversy

:-)

[caster51]

it is no ploblem that emperor will have foreigner blood.
However the basic succession is man in line

[Elizabeth van Kampen]

Or maybe prince Fumihito and Princess Kiko will have a son this year.

My question is; Will in that case prince Fumihito become the crown prince of Japan?

[caster51]

no.
next is hironomiya,eldest son

[Mike Cash]

I think they should all get jobs and stop sucking the tax teat.

[caster51]

I think they should all get jobs and stop sucking the tax teat
I think they are working harder than us as a friendship ambassador with no freedom.

http://www.kunaicho.go.jp/eindex.html

[changedonrequest]

I think they are working harder than us as a friendship ambassador with no freedom.

http://www.kunaicho.go.jp/eindex.html

Yeah but I never have heard of any of them having to get up at 2 or 3 in the morning to nurse a sick child, and then get up for work at 5 to go make some money so their family can eat. Not saying they don't do it because I really don't know, but I can't image it happening either.

Do you honestly think Masako-sama makes Aiko-sama's bento for "bento-kai" at her day care center?

Our taxes pay for their lifestyle. I'm not against the royal family but I don't particularly like someone saying that they are "working harder" than us.


519

[caster51]

they can not get out from Imperial Palace like a prisoner freely.
Do you honestly think Masako-sama makes Aiko-sama's bento for "bento-kai" at her day care center?
I think so.
kids understand how much mother loves them from bentos
kids like a mother's bento even though it is a very poor bento.
I think Taisho emperor educated them so because of his exprience
Our taxes pay for their lifestyle. I'm not against the royal family but I don't particularly like someone saying that they are "working harder" than us.
even clever masako can not follow it
masako is still incapacity for our tax paying

[changedonrequest]

they can not get out from Imperial Palace like a prisoner freely.

I think so.
kids understand how much mother loves them from bentos
kids like a mother's bento even though it is a very poor bento.
I think Taisho emperor educated them so because of his exprience
.
even clever masako can not follow it

I'm sorry but freedom and working harder are not the same thing. I know that from the news I have read and seen on TV she had a hard time adjusting to life as the Crown Princess.

Heck who would blame her, she had a great job and a bright future. At least the rest (majority) of the royal family grew up with it and not brought into it at @30 years old.

[Mike Cash]

For their lack of freedom, they are welcome to my heartfelt sympathy.

Take them off what has to be the world's greatest welfare program, let them get jobs, and they'll be just as free as we are.

And my tax money won't go toward supporting them and the 宮内庁

[caster51]

I'm sorry but freedom and working harder are not the same thing

Yes, I know it
sometime, it is own value
if tennou system is kept, it is no problem for me whether they work or not.
because it is an important nucleus of japanese identity.

Politics doesn't function without the emperor's approval for new Cabinet inauguration even midnight.

[caster51]

let them get jobs, and they'll be just as free as we are.
it is their duties as a monarch :p

内閣は、天皇の国事行為（こくじこうい）について助言 と承認を行い、その責任を負います
http://www.kantei.go.jp/jp/kids/senior/4_3.html
http://www.kunaicho.go.jp/dounittei/photo1/photo-200407-91.html

[Mike Cash]

I'm not debating their duties. I'm saying I think the monarchy should be abolished. You have your opinion; I have mine.

[caster51]

I'm saying I think the monarchy should be abolished. You have your opinion; I have mine.

I think it is not a just my opinion.
i dont think the monarchy should be abolished in Japan in general

[changedonrequest]

I think it is not a just my opinion.
i dont think the monarchy should be abolished in Japan in general

And it isn't just Mike's opinion either I would be willing to bet.

[Mike Cash]

I think it is not a just my opinion.

I know it isn't.


i dont think the monarchy should be abolished in Japan in general

Yes, we got that already. Thanks.

[changedonrequest]

Yes, I know it
sometime, it is own value
if tennou system is kept, it is no problem for me whether they work or not.
because it is an important nucleus of japanese identity.

Politics doesn't function without the emperor's approval for new Cabinet inauguration even midnight.

I can appreciate the "identity" part of keeping the royal family. I also respect your opinion about keeping the royal's as they are an important symbol of Japan.

And as I am sure you know the political side however is just for show as they are figureheads and have no "real" power.

[caster51]

however is just for show as they are figureheads and have no "real" power.
yes it is right.
even Before edo era, Emperor did not have power.
why were many shougun nominated by Emperor.?
shogun was a king
however shogun was also a servant of Emperor nominaly
It is not possible to become a shogun without the emperor's approval like today.
however
for example. Meiji Restoration occurred because there was an emperor.
he has "real power" because He has a powerless.
even after war, if there was no emperor, japan would became like iraq

[changedonrequest]

he has "real power" because He has a powerless

I "know" about that one.....any parent would.:-) :giggle:


Sorry couldn't resist that one....

[Manila]

Yeah but I never have heard of any of them having to get up at 2 or 3 in the morning to nurse a sick child, and then get up for work at 5 to go make some money so their family can eat. Not saying they don't do it because I really don't know, but I can't image it happening either.

Do you honestly think Masako-sama makes Aiko-sama's bento for "bento-kai" at her day care center?

Our taxes pay for their lifestyle. I'm not against the royal family but I don't particularly like someone saying that they are "working harder" than us.


519

Allow me to join your very intersting discussion about the Imperial Family.

My husband (a Japanese), shares the same sentiments as you do. He's been a company employee or a "salary man" for as long as he can remember. Working very hard for his country and family as well.

In relation to the heir of the throne, Princess Akishino(Kiko), wife of Prince Akishino (Fumihito), is currently pregnant with their third child. Hoping that they may have a son, this may settle the problem on the world's oldest unbroken hereditary monarchy.

[changedonrequest]

In relation to the heir of the throne, Princess Akishino(Kiko), wife of Prince Akishino (Fumihito), is currently pregnant with their third child. Hoping that they may have a son, this may settle the problem on the world's oldest unbroken hereditary monarchy.

Welcome to the family:wave: .

I understand that sentiment, yet in a small way I would like to see what happens of she has a girl.

[caster51]

yet in a small I would like to see what happens of she has a girl.
it means masako and aiko will have more trouble and pain.
because aiko won't marry by her intention or pressure , or will not have a baby
she make a line normal... to male in line
it means you dont want her a happy because some female emperor did like that.

[changedonrequest]

keitai emperor.....
継体天皇(#26)AD507-.....
samething was happend like today.



it means masako and aiko will have more trouble and pain.
because aiko won't marry by her intention or pressure , or will not have a baby

she make a line normal... to male in line
it means you dont want her a happy

Please don't put words into my mouth, the reason I said that was this; if the baby is a girl Japan is going to have to face the fact that it is necessary to change the imperial succession law to allow the first born child of either sex to be next in line to be Emperor or Emperess

If that happens I think it would be a great step forward for women in this country as well as give Masako-sama the joy in knowing that not only her husband would be Emperor but her daughter as well.

If you think about it if a boy is born Masako-sama would have more heartbreak knowing that she was not able to produce an heir to the throne. Talk about the pressure rising on her.

[Dutch Baka]

Agree with Hachiro on the last part, it would be great for women in this country.

[caster51]

If that happens I think it would be a great step forward for women in this country as well as give Masako-sama the joy in knowing that not only her husband would be Emperor but her daughter as well.
it means that from amaterasu line is cut .
we dont need such royal family that is meaningless.
some female emperor's great effort in past is not rewarded.
If you think about it if a boy is born Masako-sama would have more heartbreak knowing that she was not able to produce an heir to the throne. Talk about the pressure rising on her.
ppl should make masako to give up early.
she need a rest from pressure even now.

[changedonrequest]

it means that from amaterasu line is cut .
we dont need such royal family that is meaningless.
some female emperor's great effort is not rewarded.

ppl should make masako to give up early.
she need a rest from pressure even now.

If that's the case how do you explain away the number of Japanese Empresses that already have been in the line. Using what you have written already as a guide, the line would have been broken a long, long time ago.

You can't have it both ways you know, it's either one or the other.

Also the royal family is not meaningless just because some possibly imaginary line has been cut.

The royal family is mostly symbollic as it is, why not make that symbolism have even more meaning for the entire Japanese population including the women. It would also send a huge message to the rest of the world that Japan is truly taking steps to be a "free" and "equal" society.

[caster51]

there are many male Descendants of Taisho emperor.
hirohito line is one of them.

ppl should make masako to give up early.
I am not because I hope only for Masako's line.
i think most ppl wants just Succession of male line.
There is no problem even if it is not Masako......

they have to meet and discuss in their family with including all decendants.

[caster51]

If that's the case how do you explain away the number of Japanese Empresses that already have been in the line. Using what you have written already as a guide, the line would have been broken a long, long time ago.
at fist,
please distinguish female emperor and emperor who is in female line.
then number of Japanese Empresses were last emperor at that time.
then next was other emperor in male line.
it means japanese emerors are succeeded in male line

[undrentide]

it means that from amaterasu line is cut .
we dont need such royal family that is meaningless.


I'd be grateful if you could refrain from saying "we" and say "I" instead.
Because not all Japanese share your opinion.

[caster51]

it is not a matter which man and women are equal.
indeed, I think most japanese want to see aiko as an emperor.
however i dont admit next aiko will be aiko's child as emperor.
it is called 易姓革命.....
that is , origin of japanese emperor will change aiko's hasband in male line
because at least each person have connected with one in male line
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanov
it might be same way of Romanov.
that is ,japan become a new dunasty of aiko's husband in male line though Imperial household is kept
it ends a dynasty of 2000 years in japan

[名無し]

I thought the issue wasn't so much that there would be an empress as it was that the family line would cease to be followed through the males' lineage.Japan Celebrates: It's a Boy! (http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1531895,00.html)At 8:27 this morning, Tokyo time, Japan's Princess Kiko � the wife of Prince Akishino, Emperor Akihito's second son � gave birth to her first boy.

[Kinsao]

:cool:
I saw this news first thing... cool. :)
I'm surprised this forum isn't all over it like ants on an anthill... unless there's another thread on it that I've totally missed. *runs off to 'news and events'*

[ricecake]

Hope Masako doesn't dive into a deep depression,baby boy cousin of Princess Aiko might take the throne someday.:wary:

[名無し]

NHK news (http://www.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/dailynews.html)New-Born Prince Named Hisahito

Japan's newest prince has a name - Hisahito.

A traditional naming ceremony took place on Tuesday at the hospital in Tokyo where the prince and his mother are staying.

The baby was born to the Emperor's youngest son Prince Akishino and Princess Kiko last Wednesday.

Prince Hisahito is the first male born into the Imperial family in almost 41 years. He is third in line to the throne after the Crown Prince and Prince Akishino.

The name Hisahito was chosen by Prince Akishino and Princess Kiko in hopes that their son will live a long, peaceful life.

The Chinese character hisa means "eternal" or "calm." And hito is normally used in a prince's name.

Prince Akishino consulted the Emperor, the Empress and scholars before deciding on the name.

"It is a good name." "My grandchild has a name with the same character."

"I want to see the baby soon. I wonder when he will leave the hospital."

Besides getting a name, Prince Hisahito also received a symbol. His father chose a Japanese evergreen tree called koyamaki, or Japanese umbrella-pine.

The symbol will mark the baby prince's tableware and other daily items.

The umbrella-pine grows straight and tall, and its wood is valued as a strong, durable building material.