What is the "real" Japan for you?

[KirinMan]

I've been thinking about this for a while and decided to start this poll in the interest of seeing how people think about where is or what is the focal point of the culture for you.

To me the "real" Japan is not the large metropolitan areas like Tokyo or Osaka, but more along the lines of the historical areas of Kyoto or Nara along down to the Osen's and local festivals that can be found throughout this country. Or even down here to Okinawa and the outer islands, where the personality of the people and country can be experienced daily without having the international flavor or rush of the metropolitan areas.

To me personally the large cities have too many similarities with cities and metropolitan areas of other countries, like London, Paris or New York. Of course each is unique and different and some aspects of the repsective countries remain, however I feel like they are too international to be classfied as the "real" or possibly "imagined real" Japan, France, England or USA.

What do you think?

[bakaKanadajin]

I voted for none of the above because the poll is a little bit limiting. What we see as real and what the Japanese hold to be the true embodiment of their own culture may not be one in the same. If you're speaking from a purely foreign point of view I'd have to say its ALL culturally relevant and exciting. I love the bright lights of Tokyo's pachislot dens as much as I love hiking in Hakone and Kamakura.

If I had to guess what embodied culture for the Japanese themselves, I'd say its the areas like Kyoto or Nara where traditions, spirituality, cuisine, lifestyle, etc. are strongest and neatly meet and co-exist in this day and age. Secondly I'd say its the inaka areas where mom and pops go about tending to their tambo's and not much happens, althought these people would be far too humble to claim they are part of the country's 'true' culture. Perhaps though, city dwellers may view these countryside people as less Westernized and therefore more traditionally Japanese than themselves. (Just a guess).

[zero g]

I would say Tokyo because it is full of life everywhere and seems nice...

[FrustratedDave]

None of the above. Japan is a place to live and bring up my family. I own a house and a modest 400坪　of land and that is where my heart is.

[Ewok85]

I'd say all of it - the biggest question is which is the "fake" Japan?

[FrustratedDave]

I'd say all of it - the biggest question is which is the "fake" Japan?
And that would be.... I have no idea.:bluush:

[Ewok85]

Kyoto seemed pretty fake the last time I went - the station alone is abysmal.

[FrustratedDave]

Kyoto seemed pretty fake the last time I went - the station alone is abysmal.
I can see why you think that.

[gaijinalways]

Kyoto seemed pretty fake the last time I went - the station alone is abysmal.

I think the word you're looking for is 'too modern', especially jarring for a place like traditional Kyoto

[Ewok85]

I think the word you're looking for is 'too modern', especially jarring for a place like traditional Kyoto

"Too modern" is not what I mean, its like ripping down all but one tree in a rain forest, building up around it, and refusing to stop calling it a rain forest :p

[KirinMan]

I think the word you're looking for is 'too modern', especially jarring for a place like traditional Kyoto

Interesting point, what is the impression that people have of Japan as well. Are people looking for the traditional historical Japan or the modern Japan.

Does anyone know of a place here that blends the two together without being overly commercialized.

[Mikawa Ossan]

None of the above.

The "real" Japan to me is in the hearts of the people around me.

Just like the "real" America to me is in the hearts of Americans. (I'm American if you haven't guessed.)

Japan is a geographic region; this can never be denied. But what makes Japan specifically Japan and nowhere else is its history and culture, which, although one could easily argue can be embodied in a place, but I think of it as a more abstract phenomenon. In many cases, the 'place' was/is just incidental, although there is no question that geography has a profound impact on people.

[Alma]

well, what is "real"...? if you mean something like my impression, first though that I associate with Japan... then I would say all of above... it is mixture of old and new, traditional and (super)modern life and architecture.

:bluush:

:wave:

[yukio_michael]

I always think that the "real Japan" is hidden inside of you, if you've lived there for any amount of time... No one who hasn't been wants to break their image of what they think it might be... It's a lot of different things to me,some less romantic than I originally imagined...

Old and new, this and that, doesn't really factor into it for me... these things intermingle. It's the people, places, spaces--- nature, concrete, buildings, attitudes, environment--- I never took the time to see the 'classical representation' of Japan, because it was never important to me to go sight seeing--- I was interested in 'living'...

The film that most reminds me of Japan is Dare mo shiranai... the clacking of the train across tracks as you pass buildings and wires, and the common mansion apartments and business you see as you go.

It's just one person's perspective, that's all...

[nice gaijin]

"the life of nations no less than that of men is lived largely in the imagination."
-Enoch Powell

Reality is whatever you lay claim to. It's correct for you and at the same time utterly wrong. At the moment, the reality of Japan for me is Tokyo, since that's where I'm living. But of course, there's much more to this country than my tiny room in my tiny house in my tiny neighborhood in my tiny ward in my tiny city in my tiny....

[bakaKanadajin]

Does anyone know of a place here that blends the two together without being overly commercialized.

I've so far visited Osaka, Tokyo, Kyoto, Kobe and Hiroshima. Not a long list but a good amount of large and large-ish cities. I'd say that, so far, Hiroshima was the most beautiful in my eyes. I don't know why specifically but I think it was a combination of the city life combined with the gentle spirit of the people there. A good mix of tradition, culture and development.

Everyone there in the stores and shops and also in the country side as you move outwards a bit, is very kind. They still exhibit what in my limited experience is the traditional Japanese spirit and way of life, that polite, hard-working ethic that the Japanese are known for. A hearty 'ohayo' in the morning, 'konichiha' in the afternoon, very little of that jaded Tokyo feel. I know Hiroshima isn't the only place like this of course but again, this has been my limited experience.

Culturally Miyajima island is probably the richest location in Hiroshima. The shrines, buildings, way of life, manjuu bakeries, deer walking around freely, its all there. Also, who can forget Peace Park and the tragic history of Hiroshima..

On a lighter note, Hiroshima style okonomiyaki is everywhere, tabenasai :-)

[Uncle Frank]

my "real" Japan is here on JREF. I have my memories of Japan back in 70&71, coming here renews them. Unless I win the lottery, I doubt I will every return to Japan. So for my day to day life, the JREF Forum and all the wonderful people here are my "real" Japan.

Uncle Frank

:bluush:

[ArmandV]

my "real" Japan is here on JREF. I have my memories of Japan back in 70&71, coming here renews them. Unless I win the lottery, I doubt I will every return to Japan. So for my day to day life, the JREF Forum and all the wonderful people here are my "real" Japan.
Uncle Frank
:bluush:

Jeez, Frank. You don't need the lottery's money to go to Japan. Just save your money.

[Damicci]

I voted none because Japan contains all of the top three poll options. Anybody that has an interest in japan visted and enjoys the country will know the real japan has a slew of various differences as with most countries.

[Uncle Frank]

She's Scottish and controls the household money; I'd have to win the lottery if I wanted to go to the next state over, LOL.

Uncle Frank

:blush:

[Alma]

She's Scottish and controls the household money; I'd have to win the lottery if I wanted to go to the next state over, LOL.
Uncle Frank
:blush:

so... I heard something similar about scottish people... are you saying that stereotype is based on truth, or you are saying it just because :blush: and does she knows how you talk about her on forum :okashii::blush:just joking:p:wave:

[Alma]

and I am actually waiting for definition of ''real''. till then, I cannot vote.

:wave:

[Damicci]

You don't need a definition of real. WHat is real to you is what matters. hence the none of the above option.

[bakaKanadajin]

A few people have mentioned that real is what you make it. This is definitely true when speaking about something that can only be viewed subjectively. I would offer the opinion, however, that the Japanese can be objective about their own culture and clearly state what the real Japanese experience should be, regardless of what we foreigners believe. They are in a position to dictate what hallmarks and traditions most clearly define their heritage. If we don't grant them this then Japanese cuture by definition cannot exist. Something tangible must exist that is unique to that group.

For example if someone visited a Western country and just went to a bunch of Chinese food restaurants, played a few slot machines, hit a strip club or two and then flew home, could we really say they'd had a culturally relevant experience? Did they come away with anything they couldn't get somewhere else?

[Alma]

You don't need a definition of real. WHat is real to you is what matters. hence the none of the above option.

I said that because I see so many different answers. But I guess it is because, as bakaKanadajin said, something that is viewed totally subjectively.

[KirinMan]

You don't need a definition of real. WHat is real to you is what matters. hence the none of the above option.

Thank you that is exactly the reason I wrote that option in, to me there are probably just too many different options to put into a poll like this. I wanted to have a catch all option where people could make their choice and then explain it in a post.

After reading some of the replies I think I should have added one other option though I really didnt consider it a place but it would have been appropriate anyway....The People.

[Mikawa Ossan]

After reading some of the replies I think I should have added one other option though I really didnt consider it a place but it would have been appropriate anyway....The People.
I can add this choice if you like!:cool:

[misa.j]

I don't mean to be picky, but the thread title says, "What is the real Japan for you?" while the question in the poll says "Where is the real Japan for you?"; I wasn't sure it it was intentional and thought the answers might differ depending on which.

Maybe, Obeika can clarify that, too?

[Alma]

I don't mean to be picky, but the thread title says, "What is the real Japan for you?" while the question in the poll says "Where is the real Japan for you?"; I wasn't sure it it was intentional and thought the answers might differ depending on which.
Maybe, Obeika can clarify that, too?

finally somebody who understand my confusion :blush: That is exactly what I wanted to say.


After reading some of the replies I think I should have added one other option though I really didnt consider it a place but it would have been appropriate anyway....The People.

how come now people? can you see my question now. You said "real" and named places... and people start to answer something completely different. on ''real'' places i would say ''all of the above''

:wave:

[KirinMan]

I can add this choice if you like!:cool:

Thank you, I was "gone" for the evening watching Pirates 3 with my son. If you have the time could you please add that option as well, I would appreciate it.:bow::bow::bow::bow: onegaishimasu!

finally somebody who understand my confusion That is exactly what I wanted to say.

I missed the people part but my intent at first was the where, but decided on the what instead because to me anyway, and it could be sematics but I figured that people would be able to use the "None of the above" option to explain the What as well as Where. I didnt consider the Who at the time.

After some thought however I think that the option of "The People" would be valid as well, because in my opinion a country and it's culture stem from it's people.

[KirinMan]

I can add this choice if you like!:cool:

:yeahh::yeahh::angel:Thank you very much!

[diceke]

Japan is a place which incorporates an amalgam of differences. I don't care which is real? Nothing is fake!:ramen::keitai::halloween:music:

[包龙星]

It is a counry deeply affected by western culture,but still keeps it's own culture and customs very well,including it's bad and good ones.
What's more, girls there are more beautiful than those in anywhere else:cracker:

[Pachipro]

I voted for none of the above as I believe one cannot place a finger on, or actually say what the "real" Japan is. To each of us it is a different answer and no answer is right or wrong as each of us sees Japan through different eyes.

To me, the real Japan would be where I was living at the moment. When I lived in Japan, the "real Japan" was my 2DK apartment with it's futon, kotatsu, small refrigerator, TV and bath. The real Japan is the walk to the station avoiding traffic on small streets with no sidewalks and slight head nods and greetings to the neighbors and speaking Japanese 90% of the day.

It is the train ride to my destination or the shopping in local supermarkets and department stores. It is hot ramen and a cold beer on the way home from work or a night out. It is the buying of bento boxes to eat on the train to an onsen with friends or family. It is warming up a cold room with the kerosene heater. It is the visiting of local historical places to learn of the past history and culture. It is running the last minute to the station to catch your train in the morning or the rushing to catch the last train home in the evening. It is meeting a friend under Studio Alta in Shinjuku or in front of Hachiko in Shibuya for a date or a night out.

It is the hustle and bustle of the large cities with crowded trains and everyone constantly looking at their cell phones playing games, texting, or looking at messages and it is the quiet, serene areas in the country or suburbs where life is slower and a bit quieter. It is "irrashaimase" and "domo arrigato" when entering or leaving a place of business. It is, "Stay behind the yellow line," at train stations. It is a cold beer with dinner and hot tea with breakfast. It is sumo and baseball and shrines and temples, etc., etc.

And when I visited Japan again these past few weeks I considered myself to have experienced the "real" Japan by visiting the same house I have for the past 20 yrs, our room, the eating of all meals while seated on the floor in front of the TV, the hot bath before dinner and, again, all the things I mentioned above. Culturally, not much has really changed in my opinion these past 34 years as far as I can see with the exception of the massive construction of mansions and tall buildings in all areas.

The "real" Japan, therefore, is whatever one is experiencing while there and no two people will have the same experience. What I may consider to be the "real" Japan to me may be far different to what another may consider to be the "real" Japan to them. To paraphrase a popular saying, I guess you could say the "real" Japan is in the eye of the beholder.

[ArmandV]

Like Pachipro, I also voted "none of the above." The things he listed can be all, part or none of those things. It depends upon the person. My last trip took me to Kyushu. While nice, I seem to feel more at home in Tokyo. I've become comfortable there and have a better grasp on directions and the subway system.

Tokyo for me is primarily Shibuya, Asakusa and Ginza. What is Japan to me? I would have to say "a little of everything."

[William Spencer]

i am suspicious about words such as 'real' or 'authentic' when they are used with a society or culture or text since they take us into essentialism. the notion that a 'real' japan exists surely relies on finding characteristics to fulfill what 'real' means and from my reading of the comments so far, it's personal.

real is in the eye of the beholder. i am interested in why we want to find the real japan in the first place!

personally i could say yeah that walking in the back streets of kyoto or kanazawa or some little mura sends shivers up my spine but so does shopping in Loft in shibuya or eating some japanese sweet thing drinking tea and listening to cicadas in the summer. the viewing of sakura and then watching the changes in people and attitudes and moving along with the flow seems real. but i have merely reduced japan into these categories with the hope that i will understand it...

in some research i did some years ago, one informant told me that for her, time in japan seemed like a dream that is it was in fact not real since there was so many things that she didn't need to be concerned with in her daily life compared to her lived experience in australia. have others had this dream like experience?

[KirinMan]

real is in the eye of the beholder. i am interested in why we want to find the real japan in the first place!


If you had written I instead of we I probably wouldn't have made any comment here.

However since you did I am curious to know why you think or feel that "we want to find the real Japan in the first place"

I am not interested in finding out where the "real" Japan is, I gave my opinion in starting the thread, I live in the "real" Japan and will probably die here as well.

I started this thread to see how people posting here feel about what the country is for them or where they feel the "real" Japan exists in their opinion.
Which doesnt necessarily mean that people here are interested, or not, in finding the perverbial "it". Each person has their own opinion about what is real for them.

Doesnt mean that they are searching or looking though.

[kamikaze_sg]

I love the nature of Japan, i enjoyed the country-life than the city-life like Tokyo, Osaka or Nagoya.
I like rivers, mountains which can be found in country-side.
For Kyoto and Nara, historical sites like temples are beautiful. Houses along the streets are so traditional...... :cool:

[William Spencer]

If you had written I instead of we I probably wouldn't have made any comment here. Each person has their own opinion about what is real for them.
Doesnt mean that they are searching or looking though.

yep point taken, however there seems to be a certain amount of implied yearning or desire for the other in the question.

as you have written, each of us sees (tastes, hears, feels etc) the 'real' japan in respect to how each of us sees (tastes etc) our own construction of reality and japan gets thrown in there...perhaps this fuels so many disagreements about japan (and other places)...i want japan to be this and when someone else says, no it's not that it's this then the conversation seems to stop...

i read an interesting piece last week about the US and how many people including scholars merely reduce the US to about 5 characteristics. the point the author was making was that the US (and i'd substitute japan in there too) is too complex for that kind of reductionism.

perhaps i am searching, (we are all searching) for something 'real' so i/we can make sense of this intriguing life...(wasn't that an annie lennox song?)

[Goldiegirl]

The landing into Narita. Just looking out my window on the jet I can see that I am in a different world already. I can't wait to get off the plane and see the faces of my friends and family. That first step on to the ground makes it real to me. When I am in Japan it's all real to me. There are few things that make me feel like I am at home. That's actually a good thing. If it looked, smelled, tasted, sounded, or felt just like home, why would I want to leave home!? :)

[Glenski]

Japan is a place which incorporates an amalgam of differences. I don't care which is real? Nothing is fake!You have obviously then not compared what is under the sweaters of some Japanese women! :)

"Real Japan". It's the society, which therefore covers pretty much all of the topics in the survey. Personally, I wouldn't even have made this a survey, but just posed the question and let the thread flow, for reasons that everyone seems to be stating (personal preferences, that is).

"Real Japan" for me...
I'm married to a Japanese woman, so that's square one.
I have a job with a Japanese employer, and that's an eye-opener.
I have worked in the mainstream school system, conversation school, private teaching business, and university, so I have learned a lot about the education system here.
I've worked for a Japanese branch of a U.S. outfit and seen what a Japanese manager and secretary are like.
I have seen people be very kind and very discriminatory, very open and very closed.

Real Japan is what you experience, what you perceive, and what goes on behind the scenes, whether you understand it or not.

[FrustratedDave]

in some research i did some years ago, one informant told me that for her, time in japan seemed like a dream that is it was in fact not real since there was so many things that she didn't need to be concerned with in her daily life compared to her lived experience in australia. have others had this dream like experience?
Yeah, then it becomes a reality as time passes.