Why do Japanese women cry so much at work?

[basuotoko]

I have met many Japanese, so I've learned a lot about their working habits. For instance, I was talking about daily routines with a group of guys the other day and I learned that not one of them come home from work earlier than 9PM, and yet they wake up for work at 6. In addition to that, on the weekends they either have to come to the office or work on reports at home. I just don't understand how human beings could do this to themselves. Perhaps it's one thing if you truly love your work, but who wants to spend 90% of their conscious life in an office? Are these work conditions driving them to the edge of insanity?

My Japanese girlfriend told me last night that one of her female coworkers cried again at the office. When I asked why, she said it was because her counterpart in another area of Japan was sick so she had to take on that share of work as well, and couldn't handle it. This seems to be a regular occurrence in her department, and I know she's broken down a few times herself.

I remember reading another article on JREF from a teacher who worked at AEON, and was told during his training that he shouldn't be shocked if the female staff at his school broke down crying at times. So I've put the pieces together and now it looks like this must be pretty widespread across Japan. I've never seen my female coworkers break down in tears back in the US -- if they did, I'd be shocked.

As I've stated before on the forum, The Japanese outlook on life regarding work and leisure (or lack thereof) has become one of the most depressing areas of Japanese culture for me. Is the workload just too much for Japanese women to handle? Or is there more at play?

[Mars Man]

I just don't understand how human beings could do this to themselves. Are these work conditions driving them to the edge of insanity?

Yes !! Where the word 'them' means those who do so, regardless of on what spot they happen to be living on the face of the planet. It is, and has, driven them insane. What happens, of course, is that this insanity, becomes normality--and being normal, as we all like to suppose, is not being insane, now is it? So no. . . yappari it is driving no one insane, it is only making them more normal !!


As for Japanese women crying? Japanese men crying? Well, I would not think that it's an often enough of an occurance at the workplace so as to make it any national concern or common matter. Of the total time that I have been in workplaces here in Japan, I can recall no instances at all of workers crying at the workplace. Students? yes. The office people or other teachers? no. The workers in the restaurant/pub I did for a season? no.

I really feel the issue is moot.

[Mike Cash]

So you have:

1. A single secondhand anecdote about one Japanese woman crying at work

2. A single secondhand anecdote about Japanese women who might cry at work.

And from that you come up with:

So I've put the pieces together and now it looks like this must be pretty widespread across Japan.

and a thread title of:


Why do Japanese women cry so much at work?


Are you intentionally trying to be ludicrous?

[Mikawa Ossan]

I can think of one time where a woman cried at the workplace here in Japan, but I can think of twice where I saw a woman cry at work in America.

I don't think Japanese people are special in this regard.

[Elizabeth]

I really feel the issue is moot.
It's worse than moot in my opinion. That is to say, even more derogatory and ridiculous than the last one created to inform us of the "many times" women had been seen hanging out with men in their bathrooms...:okashii:

[masaegu]

I've lived in Japan for almost half a century, and I've never seen a Japanese woman cryng at work. Not once. Incidentally, and interestingly enough, it sounds like busuotoko himself hasn't seen one, either.

"this must be pretty widespread across Japan"?? "one of the most depressing areas of Japanese culture for me"?? Gimme a break! Don't ruin my serene Sunday morning!

[ArmandV]

My Japanese girlfriend told me last night that one of her female coworkers cried again at the office. This seems to be a regular occurrence in her department, and I know she's broken down a few times herself.

So I've put the pieces together and now it looks like this must be pretty widespread across Japan.

The only thing "widespread" about women crying in the workplace seems to be peculiar to that particular office. Assuming that what occurs in one particular workplace doesn't necessarily mean that women in "all" Japanese workplaces break down into tears.

One Japanese gal called me from Tokyo and broke down into tears while complaining about her treatment at work. From that I don't assume that all Japanese women will call long distance to California for a shoulder to cry on.

[MadamePapillon]

If the workplace is too stressful it's enough to make ANYONE cry. Though women do tend to cry more freely (we have that luxury, I don't envy men for having to keep a tough front all the time XD), I assure you men do it to, and not just in Japan either.

All it takes is one really crappy day or enough bottled up emotions to bring about a good cry. ^^

[FrustratedDave]

I have been in a few "typical" Japanese companies in the past and I have seen a lot of girls cry at work or due to work related things. My first company was very even in the amount of men and women working there. I would have to say that over half of them cried once or more in the two years that I was there.( now this is probably over 15 girls in that section of work that cried) The working conditions were very tough and they really took pride in what they did. All this combined did make for a very stressfull working environment. My second company I worked at did not have as many women there, but again there were a lot of women that cried at work and I can recall many instances were I walked into an office with another co-worker conforting someone.(I am no longer there though).

I can think of two instances were I am now where I personaly have made women cry for expecting too much from them. This was not deliberate and I was only trying to get them work more efficiently, but that was the result.

From my experience women do tend to cry quite a lot due to work, but I feel it is b/c there is a lot of pride taken in regards to what they do

[epigene]

If the workplace is too stressful it's enough to make ANYONE cry. Though women do tend to cry more freely (we have that luxury, I don't envy men for having to keep a tough front all the time XD), I assure you men do it to, and not just in Japan either.
All it takes is one really crappy day or enough bottled up emotions to bring about a good cry. ^^

Agreed!! :bravo::bravo::
In my case, I just throw tantrums on my spouse. :relief:

[basuotoko]

Look, I'm not saying that you'll walk into any given Japanese office environment and find women (or anyone for that matter) crying, it's just that I've heard about it on several occasions from my girlfriend (not just one time) and I've read another thread about an English teacher who was told that he shouldn't be surprised if he sees it. What I was really looking for is firsthand evidence from other foreigners who have witnessed this in Japanese offices and what they suspect the cause is. This IS the culture shock forum after all, and I admit I suffer from it in a lot of regards. In fact, the more proficient I become in Japanese, the worse it gets.

I've never seen (nor heard from my friends) in America of people breaking down in the office. If you have, more power to you. But I never have. I have problems grappling with why Japanese people spend so much of their lives in the office over leisure time. I believe that the breakdowns at work are a result of these choices (or commitments) and I want to understand more about them so me and the people I care about can avoid them. If other people are helped along the way, great. At least I'm not writing about anime and kanji tattoos, huh?

[basuotoko]

It's worse than moot in my opinion. That is to say, even more derogatory and ridiculous than the last one created to inform us of the "many times" women had been seen hanging out with men in their bathrooms...:okashii:

Speaking of first hand experience, I bet you have a wonderful view from your home in the US, Elizabeth. Coming from someone who uses Japanese restrooms on a regular occurrence, I can tell you that women getting a clear view or flat-out lingering in the men's room is not a rare, isolated incident.

[ArmandV]

Coming from someone who uses Japanese restrooms on a regular occurrence, I can tell you that women getting a clear view or flat-out lingering in the men's room is not a rare, isolated incident.

Besides Shinkansen trains with open windows to the men's uninals, the only men's room I can recall that the entry way was wide open with the urinals right in plain view to passers-by was at Atami Station. That was weird (and it was my first trip to Japan).

[SushiShin]

I respect female and male, and i don't like to see a good worker seeing crushed down, i know working for money isn't easy and fun at all, i know everyone wants to be paid for enjoying their life.
But if you look very good around you will see that life is hard.
In some people's eyes im small but for many people im a goodhearted and helpfull and respected youngman and for my age i have a lot of life-experience and i never give up nontheless the pain and grief i have to suffer.
And to cry is a normal reaction , everyone cries, its a signal in our head and body that makes us cry, its a signal that makes us a bit sad.

Everyone cries, there isn't a man nor woman in the whole earth who haven't cried if someone says he/she hasn't then he/she is a big fat liar!

I don't like if people cry it gives me a bad feeling inside. I watched a lot of drama's of different countries and none of them has ever let me start crying but when i look to one simple Jdoroma that is made very strong and very good, some tears starts to come out.

Now please read this and after this think 1 minute in Silence:

Only after the Last tree has been cut down,
Only after the Last river has been poisoned,
Only after the Last fish has been caught,
Only then you will find
that money cannot be eaten.

[Murs]

Speaking of first hand experience, I bet you have a wonderful view from your home in the US, Elizabeth. Coming from someone who uses Japanese restrooms on a regular occurrence, I can tell you that women getting a clear view or flat-out lingering in the men's room is not a rare, isolated incident.

Thats odd, why do those women go into mens restrooms. I mean, I can guess the obvious reason but I'm not sure. Fill me in please :wave:

[MadamePapillon]

Only after the Last tree has been cut down,
Only after the Last river has been poisoned,
Only after the Last fish has been caught,
Only then you will find
that money cannot be eaten.

That is so true. Unfortunately, as my mom always says: Money talks, bullsh*t walks. ^^ Not exactly sure what that means but it does have the ring of truth, doesn't it.

[SushiShin]

hehe that is also a good sentence :p

[made of stone]

I agree that the thread title might be better worded, but in my small experience I worked at one of the large eikaiwas for four years, and I did see many of the female staff there very upset and in tears from time to time, but never any of the men, (not a weekly occurrence, but perhaps once or twice a month on average).

In that specific environ, I put it down to the immense sales pressure (some of it akin to brainwashing, in my book) coupled with inept (at times) management, as well as the Japanese drive for perfection.

I have also, though, seen at first hand some of the effects of the pressure put on salaried Japanese workers in other spheres, for what would be considered not a very great wage here in the UK. Some of it can certainly be too much to bear (for some people). In that case, perhaps ladies feel it easier to let out than us stubborn men? (And if that is indeed the case, then lucky them!!)

[TuskCracker]

I just don't understand how human beings could do this to themselves. Are these work conditions driving them to the edge of insanity?


This happens a lot in the United States. Not much in France (wine to drink, cheese to eat, newspaper to talk about). Learn French and move to France

[ArmandV]

This happens a lot in the United States. Not much in France (wine to drink, cheese to eat, newspaper to talk about). Learn French and move to France

The downside is that the French think Jerry Lewis is a genius. :p

[Mike Cash]

That is so true. Unfortunately, as my mom always says: Money walks, bullsh*t talks. ^^ Not exactly sure what that means but it does have the ring of truth, doesn't it.

Either you or your mother have the expression backwards. It is "Money talks; bullsh*t walks".

It is used by busy people who don't have time to waste on trivial small talk, or proposals with no potential for profit on the other end. In other words, if someone comes to them regarding something which will make them money, the person is allowed to stay and talk. If someone comes to them with bullsh*t they are unceremoniously shown the door.

"Word to your mother" as Vanilla Ice would say.

[Dutch Baka]

I don't think Japanese women really cry more at work than in other countries. So I do not understand the title of this thread as well (which in my opinion is looking down on Japanese women... guess people do that a lot sometimes).

Dutch women can cry at work as well, my mother cried at work the last week... so?

[MadamePapillon]

Either you or your mother have the expression backwards. It is "Money talks; bullsh*t walks".

Oops, your right. That one got by me. :p Me and my typos.

[w1ngzer0]

I don't think Japanese women really cry more at work than in other countries. So I do not understand the title of this thread as well (which in my opinion is looking down on Japanese women... guess people do that a lot sometimes).
Dutch women can cry at work as well, my mother cried at work the last week... so?

I don't think its "downing"; more then curiosity.

I myself have cried at work. But, only because i was in immense pain inside and out. Not balling; just tears and no noise. :p

[Elizabeth]

I don't think Japanese women really cry more at work than in other countries. So I do not understand the title of this thread as well (which in my opinion is looking down on Japanese women... guess people do that a lot sometimes).
Dutch women can cry at work as well, my mother cried at work the last week... so?
There was even a Forbes on-line article with the title "The Dos and Don'ts of Crying at Work." Part of the reason women cry more is biological. So the particular stessor may differ but as a phenomenon it happens everywhere. My own workplace is relatively stress-free and there is still crying (two times that I know of in review sessions with the boss). Of course that doesn't mean it is necessarily acceptable. Anyone aiming to get ahead or be taken seriously in a hard-core corporate environment still of course has to either strategically excuse themselves or bite their lip and tongue together really hard and hope that itself distracts from the real pain.


http://www.forbes.com/home/2007/02/13/cry-at-work-leadership-careers_cx_tw_0213bizbasics_slide_8.html?thisSpeed =15000

[bakaKanadajin]

I think there is a slight hint of truth to the original title, but only a tiny bit. In general (VERY general), I've found that the Japanese are quite open with their emotions in certain situations. Usually this happens in those situations where such a display is encouraged or even expected. Conversely of course, in the day to day happenings of Japanese life, a more measured and patient approach is the norm.

For example salarymen and their drinking parties. At work, its a crisp, starched, efficient place and emotion is expected to not interfere with things. But afterwards, in a setting where alcohol and friendship breakdown workplace barriers, it's almost like a group catharsis where everyone drinks and becomes very emotional, weepy, thankful to their co-workers, passionate, etc. Maybe not at a bar in front of everyone (although that wouldn't be completely taboo) but in a situation such as this men and women may openly cry and display their emotions largely in part to the group validation.

Another example is during the receipt of accolades and rewards on TV. Men and women when they win are often very weepy, emotional, thankful, etc. On a world stage such as the olympics this is not limited to the Japanese of course, but in some lesser situations the Japanese still display an abundance of emotion. Case in point, some of the Pride Bushido fighters, TOUGH AS NAILS, men's men, .. if they win the grand prix or an especially tough fight it's not uncommon to see them cry openly despite being such reserved and stoic guys. This is seen less commonly in, say, American boxing.

If there's any kind of generality to be had here, I'd say that the Japanese spirit of patience and not displaying emotion sometimes results in an abundance of emotion in situations where they're able to finally express themselves.

[ArmandV]

Not balling; just tears and no noise. :p

You mean bawling, don't you?

[basuotoko]

I am thankful that some of you appreciate the original intent of my thread, and aren't just bashing me or trying to accuse me of putting down Japanese women, because that wasn't my intent at all.

Like bakaKanadajin said, I think it's interesting how Japanese seem to have special settings where it's appropriate (or even expected) to act certain ways. Such as when they say goodbye to a host family, they'll often cry (even the men) -- which is something that seems kind of fake or ingenuous to me. For example, there was a TV show on a few years ago where Japanese celebrities would live with a host family in another country for one weekend, and every time I watched (no joke) they would cry at the goodbye.

Perhaps Japanese women and their tendency to break down in the office is a small part of this particular custom, and even though I kind of understand why they do it, I still just can't help but to find it and Japanese behavior in general to be a bit odd at times. I guess I just want to feel like I'm not alone in my views on this, and what other people (particularly those who have lived in Japan) feel about it.

[GodEmperorLeto]

For example, there was a TV show on a few years ago where Japanese celebrities would live with a host family in another country for one weekend, and every time I watched (no joke) they would cry at the goodbye.
Dude, that's Japanese TV. They love melodrama. I mean, I'm an American, and even with all the crap I have to put up with on television, I've gotta say, the Japanese have worse TV (from what I've seen) and much more melodrama than we have. I don't think it has to do with whether they were being disingenuous or not. They wanted a show of emotion for the camera, that's all.

Perhaps Japanese women and their tendency to break down in the office is a small part of this particular custom, and even though I kind of understand why they do it, I still just can't help but to find it and Japanese behavior in general to be a bit odd at times. I guess I just want to feel like I'm not alone in my views on this, and what other people (particularly those who have lived in Japan) feel about it.
Perhaps they just break down because they work 60-70 hours a week and if they don't, they'll crack.

God, I hope when I go to Japan I don't see any of this sort of thing. I can't handle it when women cry. I guess I'm old-fashioned or something, but I just get weak in the knees when dames turn the waterworks on.

[FrustratedDave]

God, I hope when I go to Japan I don't see any of this sort of thing. I can't handle it when women cry. I guess I'm old-fashioned or something, but I just get weak in the knees when dames turn the waterworks on.
Looks like you will be walking around on your knees when you get here then. LOL

[Rahmie]

They may also be "pulling a girl" on the guys. I know I have done that in the past when something gets to be too much I make sure a guy is around and then turn on the tear. If he is gentleman he usually offer to help me with it. So they all may not be really crying. :wary:

[pipokun]

Erika Sawaguchi, BITTERLY CRYING!
07:30
Added: 1 day ago
From: ee777e
Views: 935,980
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7H210HWw00

All I can say is that the Japanese journalist lacks interviewing skills.

[scorpion da black]

maybe because japanese women are so cute when they cry :P
is it me or is japanese women really so beautifull...
seriousely..japanese peopel are more seriouse in their work and when some one messes up the responsibilty is huge!! and tender girls seem to break up fast :bluush: :bluush: :bluush:
work in japan is like being a samurai for ur fudel lord CEO

[Mike Cash]

work in japan is like being a samurai for ur fudel lord CEO
And you base that statement on what, precisely?

[Calchas]

....work in japan is like being a samurai for ur fudel lord CEO


I can see where you might get that impression. During the '80's many American managers got into the whole "samurai" work ethic buying books like The book of five rings thinking old bushido rule sets might give them a leg up on the competion.

But, in my field, if I where to work in Japan it would be long hours, long commutes, lots of mandatory team building functions and a pay scale based more on your age/time with the company then on merit.

Its not the greatest way to make a buck , but it is still long way from the harsh social code of the Samurai too.

[scorpion da black]

And you base that statement on what, precisely?

i have met some people on line..japanese and non japanese ( gaijins ) working in japan and i asked them what requierments do i need if i plan to work in japan?? and they explained to me that the have very strict displine !!
orders are to obeyed always..and there is obligatory respect from workers to mid managers ...mid managers to top managers and so on...just like the military :P higher ranking workers over lower ranking workers!

plus if u noticed i am from lebanon....the one that runs " nissan " the famous car company is a lebanese geniuse named " carlos ghosson "
and we tend to learn all his ways of economy since he is considered a national treasure ever since he got the lebanese airline company from HUGE deficit into up to the clouds profits.......and right now in operating both japanese nissan and frensh reno he embraced the boshido work ethics " altimate obidence from employees"

[Mike Cash]

i have met some people on line..japanese and non japanese ( gaijins ) working in japan and i asked them what requierments do i need if i plan to work in japan?? and they explained to me that the have very strict displine !!
orders are to obeyed always..and there is obligatory respect from workers to mid managers ...mid managers to top managers and so on...just like the military :P higher ranking workers over lower ranking workers!


Are you familiar with the term "hyperbole"?

[scorpion da black]

Are you familiar with the term "hyperbole"?

yes of course..i am a bussines and computer university graduate
but what does it have to do here..please explain more :okashii: :okashii:

[Mike Cash]

yes of course..i am a bussines and computer university graduate
but what does it have to do here..please explain more :okashii: :okashii:

It means the people you got your information from have exaggerated their description of working in Japan.

[scorpion da black]

It means the people you got your information from have exaggerated their description of working in Japan.

ohaio mike
did anything of my story about that lebanese man who runs NISSAN make anything to you?
that is a great example ..so i think it isnt that exaggerated...
unless you have a personal experience like i read before then maybe you can fill me in............i would be glad to hear that it isnt that complicated since i am planing on working there :p

[Mike Cash]

ohaio mike
did anything of my story about that lebanese man who runs NISSAN make anything to you?

that is a great example ..so i think it isnt that exaggerated...

Sounds like magazine article hype to me. Anyway, I doubt his presence has a noticeable effect on the average worker on the factory floor. On upper management? Yes. On the average Joe? I doubt it.


unless you have a personal experience like i read before then maybe you can fill me in............i would be glad to hear that it isnt that complicated since i am planing on working there :p

It is different depending on where you work, I suppose. But in practically no cases can you expect it to be militarily Spartan as others have led you to believe.

[scorpion da black]

Sounds like magazine article hype to me. Anyway, I doubt his presence has a noticeable effect on the average worker on the factory floor. On upper management? Yes. On the average Joe? I doubt it.
It is different depending on where you work, I suppose. But in practically no cases can you expect it to be militarily Spartan as others have led you to believe.

well that is a relief
i was worried that work in japan was hard..

[Uchite]

I was shopping for some sembei and the very cute girl who waited on me was very helpful. She looked and looked and could not find any. I could tell she was about to cry. She was very helpful indeed and did find them for me at last. :)