Japanese people and foriegners wearing kimono

[Tokis-Phoenix]

The kimono is japans national dress, it symbolises much about japanese culture and ideals of beauty (old, and perhaps modern too), even though japan has been "westernised" for a long time, with various steps towards westernisation taken at certain phases in its history (for example, when japan was first discovered by the west and had trade with the east india company, i think that was in the late 1600's, then again in the meiji period when japan opened its doors to the western world after centuries in virtual isolation from the western world, and in the taisho and showa period, as japan prepared and then went through WW2 and lost the war etc). The kimono has not really been worn by the masses as an everyday garment since the war years and early aftemath, but it still embraces its native dress even in this day and age (although rarely worn as an everyday garment, and when such is the case, usually by the older generations of women) etc. Summer festivals always seem to be a good occasion for the younger generations to get in touch with their native dress and grab their yukata's out of the closets/tansu and wear them at the festivals.

But how do japanese feel about foriegners like westerners and other asian groups like the chinese and koreans embracing the kimono and wearing it? Are they happy to see foriegners taking interest in their native dress, or is this not really a readily accepted thing, or something else completely? Do they feel embarassed or self-conscious/defensive when faced with a foriegner wearing kimono etc?

Have you (as a foreigner/non-native japanese) ever worn kimono in japan, and if so, what sort of reception did you get by people in general over there?


I collect kimono and wear them occasionally, i know how to wear kimono properly and the different types of kimono and obi and right sorts occasions to wear them to etc. I think that if someone (whether japanese or not) decides to wear kimono, you should make an effect to wear it properly- i have seen many westerners wear kimono incorrectly, even do glaring errors like men wearing womens kimono or grown women wearing childens obi, however i think this is only normal since access to material to learn how to wear kimono is very limited in the west unless you have access to the internet.
I have even seen japanese people though wear kimono incorrectly or very poorly though, i think this would be one of the most embarrassing things of all to do if i was japanese born and bred, however yet again it is sort of understandable considering that kimono is not worn that regularly by everyday people in japan- it does take a bit of practice to put it on right, and a fair amount of wearing to get used to it (wearing a kimono for the first time for me was like facing the same sort of discomfort i faced when i first wore high heal shoes/boots as a young teenager, you have to move differently and carefully otherwise you'll make a fool of yourself etc).

I think wearing kimono properly is the main thing and very important to know when you first start wearing kimono, although i think its fine to loosen some of the rules a bit once you know all the basics if you are just wearing kimono for yourself and not for the benefet of other people at semi-formal or formal occassions (like at a wedding or funeral etc).
But my worry would be to not be accepted even if i wore the kimono properly and well. Its tough enough over here in England, where even in our multi-cultural society, wearing the native dress of other countries still gets a mixed reception (mostly just a surpised although not tactful reception from other random people, although i have still had many positive responses on the few occasions i have worn kimono in public) if you do not actually come from that country whose native dress you are wearing. One day i would like to go to japan on a holiday, i want my visit to be pleasant, i have open-minded views about what japan is like, and it would be great if i could get away with wearing something like a yukata over there once or twice, although i would avoid doing such a thing if it would only give me a less than positive reception or embarrassment etc.

[pipokun]

It is highly likely that your friends just say "kawaii" with their camera phones.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

It is highly likely that your friends just say "kawaii" with their camera phones.


Hmm i knew of a girl who wore kimono one day in japan and she appently got a lot of giggles and stares behind her back- hearing about that has just put me off wearing kimono to japan a little bit.

[nice gaijin]

as you know, for most people in Japan, traditional clothes are just not a part of their daily lives. The yukata and jimbei only come out at certain times of year (like going to festivals and watching hanabi), and the kimono only come out a few times in one's life (shichigosan, seijinshiki, kekkonshiki, or very special occasions). At times I saw old grandmotherly women in kimono on the street, but the only time I met someone in a kimono on a normal day (albeit a very special occasion for myself) was when I went to experience the tea ceremony at a tea master's house. If you are looking for an excuse to wear kimono, traditional arts like the tea ceremony may be your ticket.

As for people wearing kimono improperly, it's easy for people to make mistakes because wearing them is such a rare occasion these days. Also because of this, it's easy for these mistakes to go unnoticed by most. This is not a matter of ethnic or national pride, as it's just a lack of knowledge on the subject, and indicative of how uncommon it is. I've never met a Japanese person my age who knew how to tie an obi correctly, they all needed someone to help them dress.

Being a foreigner dressed correctly or incorrectly in traditional garb makes one stand out, I suspect, as people wonder what the occasion is. Considering what a rare occasion it is for a Japanese person to wear a kimono, it seems a bit silly to see a foreigner walking around in one conducting their daily business, simply because they like wearing it. I once had occasion to wear a jimbei for a night on a yakatabune, and I had to take several trains to get to the harbor. Although I didn't notice anyone gazing at me, I felt very uncomfortable and self-conscious, as I was by myself and the only person dressed that way until I arrived at the boat.

That's not to dictate how you should feel about wearing traditional clothes in Japan, just trying to explain my own observations and thoughts on the subject. That said, if I see you in Japan wearing a kimono for no apparent reason, I'll giggle and stare.

[Goldiegirl]

My mother-in-law made custom kimono for a living. She gave me one that she made on our recent visit. It means a lot to me. She had fun dressing me in it. I was happy that I actually fit into it! I don't think that I would ever wear one outside of the house though. I would feel uncomfortable, like nice gaijin said, you do stand out.

[pipokun]

Hmm i knew of a girl who wore kimono one day in japan and she appently got a lot of giggles and stares behind her back- hearing about that has just put me off wearing kimono to japan a little bit.
The girl must not be her below, for the ad is in Scotland.
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/43995000/jpg/_43995468_geishaadvers300.jpg

I've never heard of kimono hunting here. I don't know what happened to the posters started threads something like "where to buy yukata" here, but no news is good news. I hope they could buy them and enjoyed yukata.

Of course, not all girls are glad to wear kimono.

「外国人七五三詣」 着物姿、似合うかな　神戸
How do I look? The 753 ceremony for non-Japanese kids, Kobe

http://www.sankei-kansai.com/05_sogo/sog102001.htm
http://www.sankei-kansai.com/parts/sog102001.JPG

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Its a shame that kimono is hardly worn at all in japan now days, its like they are rejecting it or something. It would be nice to see them embrace kimono more because it is a beautiful type of clothing and there should be nothing wrong with wearing it everyday.

Last night i dressed up in one of my yukata's as i went down to the pub for halloween, there weren't many people down at the pub but i got a lot of praise for my yukata, a lot of people seemed to really like it and my best friend is now trying to convince me that me and her should wear yukata together down to the pub on just an everyday sort of night down to the pub.
I might post some of the pics of me in yukata last night with my friends later on here if you guys don't mind :blush: .


Thanks for everyone's comments so far though, i find your opinions very interesting. I was wondering though Nice Gaijin, how easy is it to participate in traditional arts like tea ceremony or dance or caligraphy etc in japan when only staying in the country for a couple of weeks tops? I agree with you it would probably be better to create some kind of excuse to wear kimono in japan, and i have a strong interest in many traditional arts in japan, soo....

[nice gaijin]

Learning traditional arts requires a long commitment. A couple weeks probably wouldn't give you a chance to do anything other than visit a school or a master, but you need someone to introduce you; I wouldn't just show up unannounced. Also, not all arts have anything to do with the clothes you wear.

On the other hand, meeting a master or going to a school doesn't exactly count as an excuse to wear a kimono. Even for practitioners of the traditional arts like tea ceremony, wearing a kimono is a special occasion. If you really want to learn about the art that's one thing, but if you just want to play dress up on a regular basis, I'm afraid you won't find the excuse you're looking for even in the arts.

It's just a sign of the times. Modern clothes are cheaper, easier, more practical and generally more comfortable than traditional clothes, which get relegated to special occasions. As such, traditional clothes have become synonymous with special occasions, so wearing them just for the fun of it seems to diminish the importance and rarity of the event.

[weijin88]

I think the kimono is a very nice costume and it looks very graceful to me. I think the Japanese people should be grateful that their people and country are still very traditional in the sense that they can wear traditional costumes around without appearing "backward". In China, if you were to wear a Qing era costume, people will think you're mad.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Learning traditional arts requires a long commitment. A couple weeks probably wouldn't give you a chance to do anything other than visit a school or a master, but you need someone to introduce you; I wouldn't just show up unannounced. Also, not all arts have anything to do with the clothes you wear.

On the other hand, meeting a master or going to a school doesn't exactly count as an excuse to wear a kimono. Even for practitioners of the traditional arts like tea ceremony, wearing a kimono is a special occasion. If you really want to learn about the art that's one thing, but if you just want to play dress up on a regular basis, I'm afraid you won't find the excuse you're looking for even in the arts.





I really do want to learn some traditional arts, i always have done, but i have never been able to because the town where i live is not very large and i have simply never found anyone in Somerset or near Somerset who can teach me any traditional japanese arts, there aren't even any teachers who teach japanese :( .
If i was able to learn traditional japanese arts, the ones which interest me the most are tea ceremony, and the learning of musical instruments like shamisen, koto and japanese flute.

I understand that if i went on holiday to japan, my chances of taking up any traditional arts would be very difficult, but i would like to try anyway since my chances of being able to do such things back in my country are even slimmer. So its worth a try i think, as it could be my only chance :relief: .


It's just a sign of the times. Modern clothes are cheaper, easier, more practical and generally more comfortable than traditional clothes, which get relegated to special occasions. As such, traditional clothes have become synonymous with special occasions, so wearing them just for the fun of it seems to diminish the importance and rarity of the event.



I agree traditional clothes like kimono have been relagated to special occasions a lot, however i do not think wearing them just for fun diminishes their importance at all.

For example with womens kimono, there are many different types of kimono, ranging across the scale of formality. Some, like yukata, are specifically designed with the intention of only been used as town wear, casual summer festival wear and after bath wear, while other types of kimono like the tomesode, are specifically designed to be intended as specifically very formal wear. There are different types of tomesode, ranging across the scale from formal to extremely formal wear (for example a black 5 crested tomesode with elaborate dyed and exmbroidered design would be the sort of kimono a mature woman, like a mother or married woman, would wear to a relatives wedding), but have never really been semi-casual wear since the taisho, meiji and edo times.

I can totally understand why young women in japan do not wear silk furisode and furisode juban with heavy fukuro or maru obi wrapped around them as everyday wear, because not only do brand new furisode cost an arm and a leg, but they are probably one of the most impractical kimono to wear, so young women only wear them at special ceremonys or weddings etc.

But i think when it comes to the humble yukata or komon kimono (the kimono a step up from yukata in terms of formality but still only just town wear), wearing them "just for fun" doesn't take the specialness out of them because such kimono were never really intended/designed to be special kimono.


Kimono have a reputation for being expensive, and in general they really are if you buy them brand new.
Japan seems to have a problem with second hand goods though, and it is amazing how much a kimono's value drastically drops as soon as it has been bought. A brand new good quality kimono which originally cost $2500's when new, even in mint condition, could be worth only $200's simply because it has been bought and so if it was sold again it would be second hand, even if it has never been worn.

I don't know why japanese people have such an issue with buying second hand clothes, including kimono, i've heard that its to do with religious beliefs rooted in buddhism or shintoism or something like that, but apparently times are changing in that now days a lot of women are now realising the beautiful bargains they can pick up in kimono flea markets. And its true, its amazing how cheap second hand kimono can be, almost everyone one of the kimono i have bought is second hand (and they are all in excellent condition), and most of my kimono rarely ever cost more than $30's.

They say more kimono are being worn more than ever in a long time now by the younger generations in Japan. Maybe times are changing. Maybe we will see more young women wearing kimono just for fun- i think it would be good too, since kimono are there to be enjoyed, and shouldn't just be resigned to the catagory of awkward formal wear.

I think it would be a shame if japanese people grew a bad view towards people wearing kimono just for fun- its like its more acceptable/less daring for young women to go totally extreme ganguro or lolita than to simply wear their countrys native dress.

[nice gaijin]

Acceptable is a relative term. Ganguro and lolita are never alone; you don't see any gang of teenagers trying to rebel by wearing traditional outfits, do you? I'm aware of the spectrum of formality in traditional clothes, but the point is that most people are barely aware of the difference between a summer yukata and a full kimono. Despite your argument for historical significance and accuracy, it'll still be almost on par with walking around in a wedding dress.

Also, there are a ton of used clothing stores in Japan, and the prices are ridiculously high.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Acceptable is a relative term. Ganguro and lolita are never alone; you don't see any gang of teenagers trying to rebel by wearing traditional outfits, do you? I'm aware of the spectrum of formality in traditional clothes, but the point is that most people are barely aware of the difference between a summer yukata and a full kimono.


Actually i have seen groups of teenagers rebelling by wearing traditional outfits- take this pic of these couple of ladies dressed up the day in a modern take on the summer kimono (Yukata). One smokes a butt. Harajuku, Tokyo;

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gaijinphoto/21098632/



Hm i think its wrong to say that most people aren't aware of the difference between a yukata and a full on kimono (by this i assume you mean a formal kimono?) because you don't have to be a know-all on kimono to spot the differences between the formality of the two types of kimono (yukata- no silk, just cotton, no gold/metallic embroidery or elaborate dying techniques, general simple but colourful design usually), the difference between a yukata and something like a tomesode is the same sort of difference between a pair of jeans and a t-shirt and a full on smart buisness suit.
You don't have to be an expert on western culture to notice the difference in formality between a buisness suit and a t-shirt and jeans just as you don't need to be an expert on japanese culture to notice the difference between a yukata and a formal silk tomesode etc.

Despite your argument for historical significance and accuracy, it'll still be almost on par with walking around in a wedding dress.


I disagree with that due to the reasons i gave above, but for example, does this women in yukata smoking with a group of people in tokyo in an everyday scene look like she's on par with someone, lets say in england, having a cigerette break in a wedding dress with a group of people? Pic below in link;

http://www.flickr.com/photos/eishier/204825401/


Yes she looks different because she's the only one in the group wearing yukata, but you can tell no-one is uncomfortable or suprised with this due to the relaxed expressions of the other smokers around her who are paying her no attention whatsoever.

Also, there are a ton of used clothing stores in Japan, and the prices are ridiculously high.


Really? I know of quite a few second hand stores located in kyoto for example who also have online international stores, and whose prices are definately very reasonal (they sell a wide range of products, i've seen stuff sold that cost everything from between $5's to $5000's- but in general, they don't often sell very expensive stuff)- maybe you have been looking at the wrong stores, hm?

[nice gaijin]

I said that most people barely know the difference between a yukata and kimono, not that they didn't know the difference. I also didn't say that I never saw people out in traditional clothes, but they were usually going somewhere that accounted for their outfit.

I'm trying to provide a rationalization for the reactions that you and your friends have observed, but you are trying to argue their reasons for having such a reaction. This doesn't negate the reactions, or suddenly make it more socially acceptable to walk around in a kimono for not apparent reason. If the point is to stand out and get people to notice, who cares if you get stared at, isn't that the point? If you just like to wear that stuff, wear it around the house and be happy with that. If you want to go to Japan and play dress-up, don't bother trying to convince people that it's ok because you're wearing it properly, just suck it up and ignore the stares and giggles.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

I said that most people barely know the difference between a yukata and kimono, not that they didn't know the difference. I also didn't say that I never saw people out in traditional clothes, but they were usually going somewhere that accounted for their outfit.

I'm trying to provide a rationalization for the reactions that you and your friends have observed, but you are trying to argue their reasons for having such a reaction. This doesn't negate the reactions, or suddenly make it more socially acceptable to walk around in a kimono for not apparent reason. If the point is to stand out and get people to notice, who cares if you get stared at, isn't that the point? If you just like to wear that stuff, wear it around the house and be happy with that.


I appreiciate you are trying to rationalise the reactions i have talked about in this thread :cool: , i appologise if i can seem to debate too much about the little details in life sometimes.

My point in wearing kimono would be not to stand out (generally speaking, i don't like standing out in public), but because i enjoy wearing kimono because i like the look of it.
I know that this in itself alone turns the whole interest in wearing kimono into a love/hate sort of relationship- on the one hand, i want to wear kimono, but on the other hand i hate been stared at because i stand out like a sore thumb, wearing kimono makes this a likely thing to happen though etc.


If you want to go to Japan and play dress-up, don't bother trying to convince people that it's ok because you're wearing it properly, just suck it up and ignore the stares and giggles.


How can you enjoy something though when you feel uncomfortable? You say your experience of wearing jimbei was an uncomfortable one, not because people stared at you or whatever, but because "Although I didn't notice anyone gazing at me, I felt very uncomfortable and self-conscious, as I was by myself and the only person dressed that way until I arrived at the boat.".

Could anything have happened back then that would have made you feel less self-concious about yourself?

I've never been giggled at or anything like that (that was someone else experience i was talking about), but you tell me to "just suck it up and ignore the stares and giggles" etc, however although i would like to follow your advice an be strong, how can i when you have said yourself you basically weren't able to suck it up just going on the train journeys in traditional japanese clothing? I don't mean to be confrontational to your advice or anything, but...


Just wondering though, did you wear jinbei because deep inside of you you really wanted to, or did you wear it because you felt obliged to or whatever and didn't mind doing it innitially when the idea was presented to you etc?
Because i don't think you did it because you wanted to stand out, because you don't seem to like to stand out in such a way just as much as i don't, regardless of whether you like the clothes you are wearing or not?


:)

[nice gaijin]

I was uncomfortable because I was alone on a train with a crowd of strangers and I was the only person dressed that way. I just don't like to stand out that way. If I had been in a group of people (as I later was) it wouldn't have been a problem. Granted, a group of foreigners in yukata and jimbei stand out even more, but I wasn't so self-conscious about it.

It's not such an uncommon sight during the summer, but I was wearing a jimbei because the occasion called for it. I've often worn one (at least the shorts) around the house during the summer as pajamas, as is common amongst my Japanese friends.

[bakaKanadajin]

But Jinbei and Samue are more like work clothes though, it wouldn't be so strange to see foreigners wearing them. Kimono's are way more 'exclusive' I would think.

[Taiko666]

I've been on the town a few times during matsuris with various groups of assorted kimono/yukata-wearing foreigners. I've never noticed a single negative reaction from the Japanese (and I'm usually a little over-sensitive to these...) In fact, I heard them praise the foreigners' skill in tying the kimono sash-thing properly (some admitted to being unable to do so themselves.)

I own an old gents' yukata, and wore it at a house party I threw. Some of my J-friends didn't know how to get to my house from the station, so I foolishly cycled at top speed to the station to meet them, with said yukata flapping up round my ears. That drew some attention from the locals...

[Goldiegirl]

I noticed a shop where I think girls rented a kimono and then had their picture taken. I got the impression that most younger girls/women did not actually own a kimono. I saw very few young people even at formal weddings (wedding party not included) dressed traditionally. The older crowd, yep, most of them did wear kimono along with purple hair. What's with that? :) I guess if your an old lady you can dress as you please and dye your hair purple!

[nice gaijin]

The purple hair is actually from the use of black hair dye. The order of colors that fade gradually turns the hair purple. At least that's the case for the dyes that purple-hair obaasan use.

[Dutch Baka]

Interesting thread! I do hope to see some post from the Japanese on the forum.

I have worn a Yukata a couple of times (festivals/matsuri), and did not get any weird looks because of that. Of course people look at you a bit more (or maybe I just look around me more than normally), and you hear some people saying "a gaijin, kimono, etc" but nothing in a negative thing.

I have also worn a Kimono (Hakama) at my wedding ceremony, and everyone loved it. But I guess they would think the same if someone else would wear it... it's just a bit different to see someone with a taller nose wearing it ;).

I think I feel more shy to wear it, than the Japanese around me would see me wearing it.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

These are some pics of me in yukata celebrating halloween down at one of the local pubs with my friends;

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b105/dabigginger/Bumblebee/Kimono/hallo1.jpg

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b105/dabigginger/Bumblebee/Kimono/hallo2.jpg

I don't think i look bad kimono, do i :bluush: :relief: ?

[MadamePapillon]

These are some pics of me in yukata celebrating halloween down at one of the local pubs with my friends;

I love how you're like coping a feel :cool: Somebody knows how to par-tay XD

It looks fine to me, tho, granted I'm no kimono expert but I can't see anything glaringly wrong. Props.

[Tokis-Phoenix]

I love how you're like coping a feel :cool: Somebody knows how to par-tay XD
It looks fine to me, tho, granted I'm no kimono expert but I can't see anything glaringly wrong. Props.


Lol yeah, about the copping a feel, i'm very naughty :blush: ...It was a great night out though, cheers for the kind comment :cool: .

[scorpion da black]

i wish i had a male kazuko kimono, but shipping them to my country coasts three times what the kimono actually is priced.