Complex situation: visa and job in Japan

[matteo72]

Hi all,
this is my situation: I have a college degree, I am Italian, I am fluent in English written & spoken but the only word I know in Japanese is " sayonara ".
I am not rich.
I would like to come to Japan in March ( to Tokyo ) and stay some time ( at least one year or more ) in a Zen temple in Tokyo.

I have two problems: I need a visa and I need a job in Tokyo.

Here I have three possible solutions for my problems:

1) get employed in a language school ( Nova, Berlitz, .. ) before arriving to Japan, ask for a working visa and arrive to Japan with working visa and a job. Perfect solution;

2) ask for admission for a school of Japanese for foreigners, when admitted ask for a student visa or work + study visa ( what is the difference ?? ), then arrive to Japan. Since with student visa some say you can still get a part-time job, I would have visa+school+job. Eventually, when I get a " real " job, drop the school and change my student visa into a working visa ( doing this remaining in Tokyo );

3) arrive to Japan with no visa & no job, just look for a job when I am there, possibly working " in black " ( illegally - as we say in Italy, give private lessons of English, work in a restaurant during lunch-time, etc. WITHOUT having the working visa ), then when I get a real job, ask for a working visa, if my 3-month expires before I find a job, go to Korea round trip ( 500 dollars more or less ).

Here are the problems:

1) Solution number one is difficult if not impossible, in order to teach English at Nova & others you need to be native English and I am not, there are not many schools looking for Italian teachers and it is difficult to get recruited when you are not in Japan;

2) Solution number two is easier, but I would have to pay a language school which is 50,000 yen per month which for me is money. Somebody told me that there are " comunal schools " ( or something like that ), which should be free for foreigners but I do not know if I can get a student visa applying to these schools. Other problem is that many in this forum say that you can actually work with a student visa but here http://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/03.html#a they say that students are not allowed to work ( not even 1 hour per week ). I have no problem to work illegally, but if they find me are there any risks ??
Other problem is that if I find a real work while I am studying, is it possible to change my student visa into working visa without going back to Italy ??

3) Solution number 3 is the easiest but it seems risky: is it safe to go back and forth from Korea every 3 months ?? Many people say that they had no problems doing this, but .. Still I would have the problem to find a work and eventually get my working permit without coming back to Italy. Or I could work illegally, but is it safe ??

4) Then, which job can be good for me? I need to return to the temple each night at 9, so no work at the restaurants at night. So no job as restaurant waiter at night, other possible jobs are: a) English teacher but not in big schools because I am not native English, b) Italian teacher but I do not think there is much request, c) waiter in an Italian restaurant only at lunch time ( I do not think you can do this without a working visa, but I could get one, maybe ? ).

5) About the plane ticket, I think when I arrive to Tokyo I need to show that I have a round-trip ticket ( that is, a ticket back to Italy or anywhere else ); I thought about buying a round-trip ticket Milan-Narita-Milan with return date changeable, so IO can show I go back after three months, change the return date and I can go back to Italy after six months, I have to back to Italy anyway after six months to see my family ..

I know I am asking 5 questions in one post, but if you could help me I would be grateful ..

Any suggestion very welcome !!

Matteo

[Ewok85]

Well option one is out because thats a visa thing, need to have completed 12 years of schooling in the language you want to teach... there are places that want Italian teachers, you may have some luck there.

Option 2 would get you a student visa, which you then could take to immigration and ask for it to be converted to working as well, i remember reading it on the immigration website somewhere... getting a working visa outright without a sponser is a little painful (slooow, you dont know whether its gone through or isn't going through), the offical word is you need to apply from outside of Japan but really you could do it from Japan.

Option 3 is fine in that hopping over to Korea is perfectly legal and there is nothing they can do to stop you, otherwise I won't comment on the rest ;) Altho you might find it hard to get someone to hire you as a waiter, Japanese Italian restaurants aren't exactly... italian, rhey have been heavily Japanized, might be worth getting your Japanese better first.

[matteo72]

Many thanks,
Ewok !!

Matteo

[matteo72]

By the way, Ewok, I just called the Japanese embassy in Milan and they told me that, if you try to do the " go-to-Korea-and-come-back-to-Japan " trick the Japanese authorities would stop you 99 % of the times ..
Do you know anyone who actually did this and had not benn stopped by the Jap customs ??
Thanks.

[Ewok85]

I know of an Australian who did it twice to stay in Japan for 9months total, really I can't see why they would stop you, leave before the visa runs out and return after it expires theres no reason for them to deny you entry. Might be hard to explain.... get your story straight before leaving ;)

[matteo72]

Thanks again, Ewok !!

I still think trying to go back and forth from Korea may be the best option for me ..
At least I will have six months and not three to learn basic Jap talk and look after a job !!

[myrrhine]

does italy have some sort of cultural exchange program that you could enroll in? there might even be something eu sponsored... something where they would give you money to go to japan and be culturally enlightened and come back and make italy (and the eu) a better place - that kind of thing. i know sweden has something along those lines, and i'd bet it's at least part eu money. so there's a good chance there's something similar where you are.

or else, i seem to remember there being a specific kind of visa for people coming to japan for cultural activities - so i'm guessing you get the temple you're going to to 'sponsor' you and help you apply for one of these visas. once there, you could try to get some odd jobs tutoring italian or whatnot.
also, is it possible for you to get room/board from the temple in exchange for services - cleaning or whatever? i know a swedish girl who's going to a dojo to study who has that kind of a deal worked out. since room/board are probably going to be the bulk of your expenses, perhaps you could just cover pocket money by working your butt off a couple months before you go to japan, and saving up. or, again, look into side jobs once you get there.

one more thing - about the hopping back and forth between japan and korea thing - i'm sure the japanese embassy gave you the estimate they did because, well, it's what they have to say. they want to discourage it, after all. on the other hand, i do remember reading that it works alot less well these days. as more and more people have caught on to the idea, the authorities have gotten better and better at seeing through it.

phew, this is long - hope it helps though - good luck!

[matteo72]

myrrhine,
thanks for the informative answer ..
This thing about getting to Japan is looking worse every day ..

1) There propbably are some cultural exchanges like the JET program or something like that, but usually they are for younger people ( I am 32 ), there is a lot of bureocracy, few places available, you have to go to Jap and come back when they want to and not when you want to ..
Many problems !!
None ofthe Italians who have got to Japan and posted in forums recently talked about any cultural program like this !!

2) I can not ask the temple to give me a " cultural " visa, in any case, I would still have to work !! I am not rich and I need to sustain myself. The room in the temple is pretty cheap, I think around 30000 yen, but I still need top buy food, clothes, ..
So, after two or three months, I will need a job !!
I do not think the temple can give me a job in the temple, if yes, well, but if not ??

3) I know hopping back and forth between Nippon and Korea is risky ( and costly too .. ) but what are the options ?? Pay 50000 yen per month to go to a Language school and try to get a student visa ?? Still, I need to work ..
I can not see many other options here.

[nhk9]

I guess you could definitely try to find a job in Japan that fits your college major. Since you're 32 already so I assume you have had quite a bit working experience in whatever field you are in. I think most restaurants and the like there tend to hire more younger people than people in your age...

Maybe you would also want to try hopping between Nippon and China? There are some ferry services from Japan to like Shanghai or Tianjin, which I assume are cheaper than flight tickets there.

You might also want to think of a place other than Tokyo or the metropolitan areas. From what I've heard if you want to seriously learn the language it's advisable to go to areas where there are less foreigners (perhaps places like Niigata, or Hokkaido). These areas tend to have lower commodity prices, so your savings account should last longer.

[matteo72]

nhk9,
thanks for the tip.
I would like to get " real " job in Japan, but everybody says that " real " corporate jobs are off-limits for foreigners.
I will look after the possibility of hopping between Nippon and Chica, thanks..
About where to stay, I need to stay in the Zen temple in Tokyo and sleep there.

[matteo72]

I mean " .. hopping between Nippon and China " ..

[mr.sumo.snr]

You state you are 32. I therefore assume that you have a job, perhaps even a career, which you are willing to give up and take your chances here in the Japanese job market. I think you're asking a lot of yourself to be able to deal with the stress that comes with short-contract, perhaps even technically illegal employment in a foreign country.

In your situation I think I would investigate how I can use my bi-lingual skills to secure legitimate, at least one-year contract employment. Is there an Italian equivalent of the CELTA qualification (the short, usually 4 week certificate in teaching English as a foreign language).

Language schools in Japan of course concentrate on English instruction, but not exclusively - at least not in the major cities. I expect those schools that do teach Italian language classes and employ native speakers would give preference to a teacher fluent in English.

[matteo72]

Dr. Mr. Sumo,
thanks for the answer !!
I passed the TOEFL test and the GMAT test ( Test of English as a Foreign Language and General Management Aptitude Test ) both with high grades.
I would have no problem teaching Engish, it is NOVA and Berlitz which clearly answered me that they do not accept non-native English teachers.
But if you know of other major schools which accept non-native English teachers, I would be grateful !!
I am also a graduated engineer, but everybody tells me Japanese corporations do not recruit gajins.

I also need to learn Japanese FAST !!
I am already studying.

[mr.sumo.snr]

To work here as an engineer you'd have to be able to offer something the companies cannot get from the local workforce supply - difficult, not impossible bit probably impractical without excellent Japanese language skills.

Have you enquired at Berlitz about positions to teach Italian. What I was asking about before was: Do you have or can you get a certificate that would qualify you to teach Italian? That might be a method of securing employment here. Alternatively, check out every other language school you can find - GEOS, ECC, anything private - look at

http://www.eltnews.com/home.shtml
http://www.eltnews.com/community/
http://www.gaijinpot.com/
http://www.ohayosensei.com/

Get mailing and perhaps even calling. There are literally thousands of independent language schools all over the country. All you need to find is one where the owner or his wife has a bit of a 'thing' about Italy and you'll probably find yourself with a job.

[matteo72]

Dear Mr. Sumo,
thanks again for your informative answers !!
You seem to know very well the teaching job market in Nippon !!
I will try to do what you suggested, seems the best solution for me !!

I will come to Tokyo probably the last week of March and then I will try to contact as many language schools as possible.
I will also bring from Italy all the papers of my degrees, so I will be able to show that I have good Italian ( and maybe English ? ) teaching abilities ..

Regards,
Matteo

[mr.sumo.snr]

I'd get cracking on trying to find a job even before you come to Japan. In other words contact schools now. Is there a special education newspaper printed in Italy? In the UK they have the TES (Times Educational Supplement) in which many Japanese language schools advertise for teaching staff - true, they want native English-speaking staff but it's just a thought. I guess there must be some sort of market for Italian language teaching worldwide.

Please note that the Japanese academic year runs April to March for all public schools. Many private language schools also look for new staff at this time of year.

I just came across this thread http://tinyurl.com/6g3bh at Gaijinpot.com - not exactly what you want to hear but nevertheless useful information.

[matteo72]

Thanks Mr. Sumo,
it seems that the best bet is to look after Italian teaching jobs, since in the thread they say that " I think it will be near impossible for a non-native speaker with no degree to get sponsorship of a work visa to teach English here, considering there are so many native speakers with degrees and valid work visas ".
I have already tried to look after Italian teaching jobs from here but no success !! Anyway, as you suggest, I will keep trying and trying ..
About the TES, AFAIK, we do not have this kind of paper in Italy, the only resource I know is the web.

Regards,
Matteo

[matteo72]

I will try to post some messages on Gajin Pot !!