What do you think of feminism?

[Ma Cherie]

Hi folks, I was just wondering what you thought about feminism. And how belive it's affected your lives. You may know that there are certain types of feminism, like ecofeminism, the infamous nazi feminsts, and there's even a branch of feminist economics. I'm not a feminist by the way, but I am someone who is rather concerned about the treatment of women in other cultures. (Hence, my recent thread female genital mutilation). Anyway, some of you probably think feminists don't shave or refuse to wear make up, and things of that sort. But there are so many areas of feminism. I just want to know everyone's opinion.

[Brooker]

I agree that women should be considered equal, but it seems that many feminists want to be considered BETTER. And that's just shifting the imbalance to the other side.

[isayhello]

Women should off course get equal rights and pay and all that. But feminists, at least the hardcore ones, are sometimes a little too agressive and seem to be more interested in hating men than actually achieving something. Women shouldn't be BETTER than men. Also, some feminists seem to have low self esteem, since they have to fight the pretty models and stuff like that.. it's as if they can't accept themselves and feel bad everytime they see a model or something. In Sweden, we've got LOTS and LOTS of feminists, and some are really exaggerated and vicious. They do sabotage on H&Ms (clothes store) model campaigns and rip down the model posters... Thats not fighting for equality, according to me... Talk about getting equal payment for equal job instead...

[Index]

I think Germaine Greer was right when she said that we should encourage diversity between sexes rather than trying to force the notion of equality-diversity gives more options.

[geist_seig]

Its only amatter of time before completely feminatine dominated, just a simple fact. o.o; any way...dont hurt me?

[Shas]

woman equal to man theres nothing wrong with it. and i believe its allright to fight for it but on the other side many feminists go so far that they need to portay them better then men to compensate for the fact that its still the other way round in our society

my mom (feminist) allways refused to cook, sow (fixing clothes, buttons, and stuff), iron etc for us so I was able to do it all by myself by the time i was 13 or so. nothing wrong with that. girls like it

[stalky]

Originally Posted by isayhello

Women should off course get equal rights and pay and all that. But feminists, at least the hardcore ones, are sometimes a little too agressive and seem to be more interested in hating men than actually achieving something. Women shouldn't be BETTER than men. Also, some feminists seem to have low self esteem, since they have to fight the pretty models and stuff like that.. it's as if they can't accept themselves and feel bad everytime they see a model or something. In Sweden, we've got LOTS and LOTS of feminists, and some are really exaggerated and vicious. They do sabotage on H&Ms (clothes store) model campaigns and rip down the model posters... Thats not fighting for equality, according to me... Talk about getting equal payment for equal job instead...

i don't think that feminists sabvotage on h&m models campaign because they have low self esteem - they are doing such thinks because they want to change the way women are percepted - as a sexual object - and showing half-naked babes doesn't help other women and men in thinking that feminine is more than only sexuality
feminists are trying to show us that woman = human (because as we can see some people forget about that), because only as a human woman means something - she's not a beatiful addition to man, she can have her own life, make decisions on her own and live in the way she like it and because of that people will respect her


i don't like the situation when people are saying that you're not a real woman because you earn too much, you're too intelligent or the most stupid - you're not wearing make-up or not shaving legs i don't see a problem in it - our bodies belongs only to us and we can do with them whatever we like
i don't wear make up because i just don't need - so is it wrong because i'm not like most girls? because i fell strange wearing sth on my face?

and about agression - it's common that people who fight for their rights are not very gentle - look for some politician, for national minorities and so on..
they suffer a lot so how can they be peaceful in every situation - beside that if you think that feminists in 21st century are agressive - you propably don't know what happened in england when woman were fighting for voting rights...


and about this feminists who are too agressive, don't know the ideolgy of feminism, hate men - such black sheep are everywhere - like in politics for example the left has so beautiful ideology place emphasis on social things but on the left side we have also comunists and anarchists - same with feminism - it's not uniform

and some comic about feminists i found :

[Ma Cherie]

I have came across several defintions of feminism. Here's what I found interesting about radical feminsim This form of feminism has caused some women to question things such as family and child-bearing. Things of that sort. Lesbienism also became sexual issue, or perhaps the best term for this is separatist feminism . Meaning that they either choose to live in celibacy or in a lesbian relationship. You could even say that women who organize women-only events are separatist.

Then there's cultural feminsim, this area of feminsim teaches the the importance of celebrating the differences of men and women, or celebrate the the qualities of women. Such as women being better caregivers, being more nurturing, the whole "there would be no wars if the world were run by women" sort of thing.

Pop feminism This is a very interesting area of feminsim. For one, this teaches the moral or superiority of the female gender. Where women enjoy more rights and men are marginalized. (Yes, there are some feminists who belive that women should be better than men). I guess their whole hidden agenda is all anti-male.

I hope this was helpful information.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by Ma Cherie

Hi folks, I was just wondering what you thought about feminism. And how belive it's affected your lives. You may know that there are certain types of feminism, like ecofeminism, the infamous nazi feminsts, and there's even a branch of feminist economics. I'm not a feminist by the way, but I am someone who is rather concerned about the treatment of women in other cultures. (Hence, my recent thread female genital mutilation). Anyway, some of you probably think feminists don't shave or refuse to wear make up, and things of that sort. But there are so many areas of feminism. I just want to know everyone's opinion.

You know I was going to make a comment on how I feel about feminism, but I'm afraid I might offend some of the female users on this site, so I think I'll keep to myself on the matter.

Doc

[Ma Cherie]

Yes, I know Doc, this is kind of a touchy subject. But if you have some views I would be very happy to hear them. The female users on this forum seem pretty nice. But it's up to you, really.

[Doc]

Well simply put, feminists really steam me up. Most of the ones that I have met are all into women dominating over men. I honestly find that unfair and sexist. Look I believe in equal rights and equal wages. However, I also believe that women should not be given the same amount of pay as a man for doing less work, but still getting the money anyway just because she's a woman. I believe the same way for a man too.

I believe that women should have an equal opportunity in sports and several other activities, but I think they go a little bit too far when they want men’s only country clubs to be equal, or that the boy scouts should be unified with the girl scouts. There are some things that should be exclusive only for one particular sex. I mean would women like it if men wanted to be in every single club or activity that they solely participate in? What I mean is while I believe in equality, and I also believe in individuality of the sexes as well. I mean we should make most things equal, but there are some things that are more oriented for one sex or the other, and should stay that way. It shows that both sexes are in tune with the each other’s differences, and value their uniqueness.

This is why I hate affirmative action most of the time. I can also see why it still has never gotten pasted. I think that if we make everything absolutely equal, then we all lose our uniqueness that makes us, us. That’s why I hate most of these feminists and male chauvinists. Most of these feminists also think that they are the only helpless victims with everything that goes wrong. What about African Americans, Asians, Latinos, and white males that weren’t wealthy land owners? We have finally been liberated just as much as women have. We as males don’t have to follow the gender roles that the men in the past have had to, nor do women.

Now I will not deny that there are a lot of men that are unfair, and that there is still unfairness in our system, but I think has gotten better. The old fashioned politics that our ancestors is finally starting to phase out, as we as human beings begin to evolve. I think it will only be a matter of time before co-ed activities are the norm, and there isn’t as much pressure or emphasis placed on the differences between the genders. Still even when that time comes, I would like to hope that people for the most part don’t act unfair towards one another on who is the better sex. It does nothing but bring pain, heartache, and hatred towards one another. This is why I don’t like feminists.

I hate to admit it, but the mere mentioning of the word pisses me off to no end. The same goes for male chauvinistic pigs. I hate them both. I think they do nothing but bring shame to both sexes, and show the immaturity and insecurity that people in both sexes have. That is how I feel. I apologize if I offended anybody here as that was not my intention. I merely wanted to express my views on the matter without sounding spiteful. Once again my deepest apologies to all of those I may have offended.

Doc

My mums friend scares the hell outta me because shes so pro womens rights. She had an argument with her daughter about the election which her daughter wasnt going to vote in, and her mum screamed at her saying "women died so you could vote!" the daughter replied by saying "i didnt ask them to"
Anyway, if a woman wants to go out and earn a living, let her. If she doesnt want to stay home and cook or look after kids, then fine. Do what you want, its your life with your own choices to make. Besides, im as lazy as hell and dont wanna get a job. Id rather be sitting at home, cooking food and watching the kids.
Sorry if i offended anyone

[Tim33]

I believe that women should be equal however i have found that most women who fight for this actually fight for more then equality and ruin the very point of there argument.

I generally find feminists think of themselves better then men and it is here that i lose all respect for them.

There was recently a womens only gym opened near me and no one seemed to care. However i know that if the same was to happen with a mans only gym there would be quite a few feminists causing trouble.

Originally Posted by HomicidalMouse

Anyway, if a woman wants to go out and earn a living, let her. If she doesnt want to stay home and cook or look after kids, then fine. Do what you want, its your life with your own choices to make. Besides, im as lazy as hell and dont wanna get a job. Id rather be sitting at home, cooking food and watching the kids.

Exactly i dont see the problem, if you ask me its alot easier life. I generally do all the cooking anyway because i like it. If i had a wife that did not get a job and go out and earn i would soon send her packing.

[Ikyoto]

The problem with most any "movement" is that it puts people into categories. Whenever I've bene in a position to evaluate someone either in the workplace or classrom i refuse to look at race or gender or religion - those are actually removed form any forms I have to use. I judge the person on their work and ability and nothing else.

Nice way to think aobut things, but I know that to get ther rest of the world to do the same we have to get rid of the conflicts that people seem to love - on all sides.

My wife has friends who always say "you know how men are..." and "that's a guy thing...".

But if i turn it around and make a comment about "all women..." they get offended. So I did it on purpose and said after they got mad at me, "Well, next time you feed a stereotype about men, think about how your "innocent" comment can cause you to see someone as a THING liek a male or female rahter than as a PERSON first."

One of them has never spoken to me since that and the other two appologized.

[alexriversan]

my opinion about feminism:

woman should have the same opportunities in terms of employment, but technical jobs require technical skills, not only "secretary" work. this is a job nearly exclusively reserved for woman, and they are good in "recognizing" "eglible candidates". like me.
i know it has changed to "human resources".

about shaving, feminism would refuse to do so: that's really funny. people have the right to be ugly, of course, but body hair/beards etc. is considerd as unattractive. means it is not specific to woman.

probably woman can understand, man like to cook to, like using the microwave, and have emotions as well.

and man should abandon the symbol of big "tits" as such. they are not attractive at all, only suggested by wrong education. the subconscious mind
sees a neverending source of easy-to-obtain nourishment, hence some men are looking for big "tits".

counscious people know it's only an abberation, little "tits" are much more attractive. especially when girls fight with each other, the use to, don't they?
i mean, fighting or big "tits", not both things...

so far...hope i have not written something against woman?

[Ma Cherie]

Originally Posted by Tim33

I believe that women should be equal however i have found that most women who fight for this actually fight for more then equality and ruin the very point of there argument.

I generally find feminists think of themselves better then men and it is here that i lose all respect for them.

There was recently a womens only gym opened near me and no one seemed to care. However i know that if the same was to happen with a mans only gym there would be quite a few feminists causing trouble.

Exactly i dont see the problem, if you ask me its alot easier life. I generally do all the cooking anyway because i like it. If i had a wife that did not get a job and go out and earn i would soon send her packing.

It sounds like the gym situation was founded by separatists. I'm not all that surprised that a group of feminists would get all rowdy about a men's only gym. This what I don't understand, whenever there's a situation in which there's only men's only clubs, schools, gyms, etc. They get angry, saying that it's sexism. But if this situation were reversed, feminsits would say that women only organizations are needed. I question most of their ideologies. In all my time of studying feminsim and it's goals, I came to realize that I didn't get it.

Well, it sounds like you're pretty much set for life.

[TheKansaiKid]

I can't remember his name but there was an American comedian that used to do a bit about feminists. The punch line was that all the feminists changed their story when the ship started to sink. They were the first in line at the lifeboat under the women and children first policy.

[alexriversan]

Originally Posted by Ma Cherie

It sounds like the gym situation was founded by separatists. I'm not all that surprised that a group of feminists would get all rowdy about a men's only gym. This what I don't understand, whenever there's a situation in which there's only men's only clubs, schools, gyms, etc. They get angry, saying that it's sexism. But if this situation were reversed, feminsits would say that women only organizations are needed. I question most of their ideologies. In all my time of studying feminsim and it's goals, I came to realize that I didn't get it.

Well, it sounds like you're pretty much set for life.

probably, feminine groups are accepting male members, if they are not sexistic towards them? if they declare explicitly: "i am not too sexistic and won't grab woman. also, i respect sensitive situations, when woman are together." i assume, man are laughing at it sometimes, and this hurts woman.

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i am soo interested in woman's psychology... let me know more

[Ma Cherie]

I was wondering about a couple of things. Have any of you guys encountered a situation in which you were trying to be chivalrous and a woman seemed irritated by your simple act of generosity, or perhaps even angry? Well, I've noticed that some of my male friends feel that feminism has done nothing than preach anti-male. I would say radical feminism is responsible for this. But I was just curious if any of the guys here has experienced something like this. It kind of sad, American women these days seem to be protrayed as nothing more than b******.

[Zauriel]

I was sometimes under the impression the feminists don't want equality. They want female domination over the society and the social life.

[Dream Time]

i support equality, but 'feminism'..i think they have crossed the line, it seems to me that they want the females to be superior than males some girls are like, guys must open the doors for girls, and everytime they go to a restaurant or whatever, the guy must pay for her

[Duo]

I think the women's movement to achieve equality is good, but feminism is usually too overboard for my liking. Feminists will argue always woman is better than man, etc etc, but if they just argue women is the same as men i think their campaign would be more efficient because today i think hardly any man will tell you that a woman is lower than a man. But if one comes out screaming women are better, men suck, of course males will get defensive.

[zeroyon]

One of my teachers last semester was a complete feminist, and it showed up in her grading as well. Also... she would always bring in videos and documentaries depicting males as bad people and women as more superior, and make us write a paper about it. Of course you couldn't disagree with the video, or you would get a bad grade. For example, for one of them we had to provide 10 examples from the video of "why women are morally, emotionally, and intellectually more mature than men".... like WTF is up with that?

I think that SOME feminists have done some good, like restore equality in some places which were definately sexist towards women and unfair. But as for the vast majority.. they are nothing but hipocrates and do no good for society at all.

[Ma Cherie]

Originally Posted by Dream Time

i support equality, but 'feminism'..i think they have crossed the line, it seems to me that they want the females to be superior than males some girls are like, guys must open the doors for girls, and everytime they go to a restaurant or whatever, the guy must pay for her

That's interesting you'd bring that up, becuase I've learned from some of my male friends that they had and one point or another tried to be chivalrous they were either called chauvanist pig, or the girl looked very irritated. This is strange, on the one hand, feminists want to be liberated from such things, but on the other hand, some feminists still believe the man should be chivalrous. Feminists have contributed to this society, but they've also contributed several double standards.

[sgt. Pepper]

Well, Sweden is the headquarters of all agressive anti-male feminists, especially now with the feminist-party (that's the real name...). Embarrassing. I hope all radical and anti-male feminists just gets a massive heartattack, all at once. I mean, of course there's nothing wrong with preaching equality, but many feminists step over the nazi-line.

Just a common example of feminist-stupidity. We have "forced armed service" (i don't now what it's called, a conscripted army or something) in Sweden, and though the feminists scream bloody murder about unequal pay and a bunch of other things, they never ever mention that only males can be forced to do armed service. If they want equality, then they should get ready for the negative things too, it's not like every day is a sugarcoated rosedancing chocolate cake for us guys.

I'm sorry if i'm incoherent (or is it inconsistent...?), i'm really tired, and then my english gets worse.