Are you a patriot?

[craftsman]

The following are a collection of quotes about patriotism from a variety of people from different countries. Before you read them please note that I chose all negative ones! Oops - I think I may have given myself away here. My questions are:

• Do you agree with these quotes?
• Is Patriotism really worth the effort?

God and Country are an unbeatable team; they break all records for oppression and bloodshed.
Luis Bunuel Portoles (Spanish-born filmmaker)

Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it.
George Bernard Shaw (Irish playwright)

Nationalism is our form of incest, is our idolatry, is our insanity. Patriotism is its cult. It should hardly be necessary to say, that by patriotism I mean that attitude which puts the own nation above humanity, above the principles of truth and justice; not the loving interest in one's own nation, which is the concern with the nation's spiritual as much as with its material welfare --never with its power over other nations. Just as love for one individual which excludes the love for others is not love, love for one's country which is not part of one's love for humanity is not love, but idolatrous worship.
Erich Fromm (German-American psychologist and humanistic philosopher)

Patriotism is a arbitrary veneration of real estate above principles.
George Jean Nathan (American critic and writer)

Patriotism is the willingness to kill and be killed for trivial reasons.
Bertrand William Russell (British philosopher, logician and mathematician)

Please feel free to quote back but lets not get into quote wars.

[miki78]

lol quote wars

I think perhaps hmmm patriotism is a bad and good thing though it teaches respect it also teaches arrow mindness

My Aunt who i can't stand is a terrible racist becouse she was tought briton should be briton ie only for white people that kind of outlook makes me furious

Oftain wars have been coursed simlpy by one country insulting another whicj is pathetic

It is true that i would bugger briton for Japan anyday though which is also a form of patriotism to Japan

But i always seem to be the one in my family sticking up for old blighty and proud when they do finally get something right

And at the olympics decision i was glued to the screen

Deep down inside i love england and have had my personality as described as very english

But i'am exstremly anti royal *don't get me started*

But my family where all German Jews and as such i oftain have a protective attitude towards germany

And i think there is also a religious patriotiam becouse i will oftain be there to protect Jewish and Catholosism tooth and nail

But that kind of Patriotism can course violence aggresion over sesitivity and narromindiness

I agree with Bernard shaws quote in perticuler

But disagree with Bunuel Portoles quote to some degree becouse God is not the one who asks us to fight over him it is us that chooses to fight over him

I also agree with william russell oftain people will fight wars over ridiculous things

OK i'll shut up and let somebody else get a word in lol

[Mycernius]

I'm English, so I know I'm better than everyone else

[Goldiegirl]

I love my home, my lifestyle, my neighbors, my little town, so I would say I am patriotic. I may not approve of what my country does, but it's still home, and home is where the heart is!

England is kinda like the parent of the US...or that's how I always think of England. Boy I could go for some chips and brown sauce!!

[leonmarino]

Originally Posted by Mycernius

I'm English, so I know I'm better than everyone else

Haha!! Does that fall under "patriotism" or "ignorance"? Kidding mate.

I once read a book about the English oppression in Ireland, which started with a quote, which roughly said that patriotism is good because it means you care about your fellow countrymen. Which is true ofcourse, but I think patriotism (and nationalism) is a double-edged sword.

It can be good as I said because that means you care. You care about your fellow citizens, about your history and heritage, and it means you respect the national institutions.

On the other hand, it can work as a limiter as well. By "blindly" supporting and protecting your country and its institutions you might just work against yourself, and your people's survival. This case is most evident in the Vikings' life on Greenland, in which they held on to their values and customs from Norway (or was it Denmark? Ah well, doesn't matter) so stubbornly that they became extinct. All the while the Inuit people (originally from the American continent) were able to survive much longer because they adapted their eating patterns (very much related to values), hunting methods etc.

So, well, yeah, to conclude: it depends. It's the survival of the fittest. Sometimes it means you have to persevere, sometimes it means you have to adapt.

Am I making any sense?

[sabro]

I love my country. I love the values that my country is supposed to stand for: of freedom, democracy, equality, justice...

But on the balance, I'd say patriotism as a characteristic, is overrated.

[miki78]

I think most Americans are patriotic arn't they or is that a sterotype?

You know they have poppy day celebrations on TV at the mo i thought they canceled it

I remeber being so mad when i thought they had cancelled it becouse it was like poking all those brave people who do fight in conflicts in the eye

It always reminds me of this song lyric

And war is always the choice
Of the chosen who will not have to fight

I have always thought of Patrism as to the goverment or royalty

And i have respect for all human beings regarless of natality in equal messure

But i also come from a militery background

i think it is something very confusing becouse i hate the UK goverment but i'm proud to be Brittish

I'm not sure or not if that is a kind of Patroism?

[Goldiegirl]

Being an American, yeah, I would say most of us are patriotic. But, just like you although we are patriotic we still may not support what our country is doing, and that doesn't make you any less American, to me it shows that America is working the way it should.

[miki78]

^^ yea to love your country but to be able to critise it i think means you love it more ^^

Hmmm actully i'm so anti royal it has become a joke in my home lol

I do love england but i don't like what it has beome its sad ;_;

[craftsman]

Miki78, I've been looking through the posts so far and was going to comment on some of the stuff you said, but there was so much in there, that I got rather tired and my eyes started to hurt! You clearly love Britain or England in particular, but I was wondering about the earlier post

Originally Posted by miki78

It is true that i would bugger briton for Japan anyday though

What traitorous talk is this? I believe technically you could be sent to the Tower of London for talk like that.

Also I noticed that you have the welsh flag flying under your name. Now I'm really confused.

[Broken Rose Ren]

^ I think she just means, she loves her country...just not it's current state. Which, is why she would trade it for Japan because she's in love with Japan.

[Revenant]

Canada rocks! The laidback multicultural land of beauty. However I'd never go to war for Canada. I'll stick to trying to be objective and fair about balancing various countries needs, and not be arbitrarily placing my country's interests above any other country's.

[Nicky]

Originally Posted by miki78

I think most Americans are patriotic arn't they or is that a sterotype?

It's probably not a sterotype, but I pesonally am not very patriotic(according to my mother). =/

Basically I think it'd be a wonderful experience to spend a few years living in another country that is not the U.S, and she thinks I'm crazy because "America is the best" or something to that effect. It's really bizarre, Anytime I've ever mentioned "oh I wonder what living in XXXX would be like" She wasted no time in commenting on how that specific place was bad or just not as good as the country I'm currently in for some reason or another. This is a woman who has never been out of the country and yet somehow she believes that she knows everything about everywhere, and insists that America/U.S.A is truly the best out of all of them.

My favourite (recent) "America rocks" flavoured comment by her was "Well even though there are bad things here, at least when something happens(natural disasters/hippie infestations/etc) the government takes care of it". I find it amazing and a bit embarrassing that she just randomly decided that other countries don't do the same. (by the way, that's not an exact quote but it captures the gist of it) The strangest thing of all is that she didn't used to be like this.

I think there are plenty of great countries out there. And they all have their good points and bad points. Neither one is "better" than the other. Because of this my mom thinks I'm naive(probably true but at least I have an open mind) and a blasphemer. Also I'm a Bostonian and I don't care for the Red Sox, so I'm a blasphemer on two accounts.

[Philip]

I love my country. I like to travel outside it. But, I do not have the slightest intension, to move outside my country.

[RockLee]

Well, I for once am not a patriot at all, and would like to move abroad asap Belgium has it's charms, but I don't want to live here my whole life. I want to live abroad and experience life outside Belgium.

[Kinsao]

I'm not particularly patriotic. I can see some good things and some bad things about England (and the UK as a whole).

I think it's best to appreciate the positive things but not be blind to the negative aspects as well, because that's just... stupid. XD

I'm not gettin into quote wars cos I'm no good at that kind of thing but I want to quote EM Forster:
"If I had to choose between betraying my country and betraying my friend, I hope I would have the guts to betray my country."

[craftsman]

Originally Posted by Goldiegirl

home is where the heart is!

Yes, how true. The trouble is I've been moving so long now that I lost a sense of home. If I go back to where I used to live or where I was brought up - I feel foreign. So - home is where my family is. (always with me)

Originally Posted by Goldiegirl

Boy I could go for some chips and brown sauce!!

Or chips with gravy or chips with curry sauce.

Originally Posted by Philip

I love my country.

Originally Posted by sabro

I love my country. I love the values that my country is supposed to stand for: of freedom, democracy, equality, justice...

But on the balance, I'd say patriotism as a characteristic, is overrated.

I could not bring myself to say that I loved my country. I like many things about it as I do other countries. Perhaps if I could make a country of all the bits I liked of mine and other countries, I could say that.

Would you say that there was anything in the George Bernard Shaw quote about loving your country because you were born in it? There are many countries that claim those values for their own.

Originally Posted by Nicky

I think there are plenty of great countries out there. And they all have their good points and bad points. Neither one is "better" than the other. Because of this my mom thinks I'm naive(probably true but at least I have an open mind) and a blasphemer. Also I'm a Bostonian and I don't care for the Red Sox, so I'm a blasphemer on two accounts.

I'd call it enlightened thinking.

I think technically you are sent to hell for the last one!

Originally Posted by Revenant

Canada rocks! The laidback multicultural land of beauty. However I'd never go to war for Canada. I'll stick to trying to be objective and fair about balancing various countries needs, and not be arbitrarily placing my country's interests above any other country's.

Damn. I have to go to Canada.

Originally Posted by RockLee

Well, I for once am not a patriot at all, and would like to move abroad asap Belgium has it's charms, but I don't want to live here my whole life. I want to live abroad and experience life outside Belgium.

I think that for many people the only way you can really know your country is by leaving it. You start to see things from a new angle and when (or if) you go back you understand it better or love it or hate it more than you did.

Originally Posted by Kinsao

I'm not gettin into quote wars cos I'm no good at that kind of thing but I want to quote EM Forster:
"If I had to choose between betraying my country and betraying my friend, I hope I would have the guts to betray my country."

Yes, I like your choice of quotes, Kinsao.

[miki78]

Originally Posted by craftsman

Miki78, I've been looking through the posts so far and was going to comment on some of the stuff you said, but there was so much in there, that I got rather tired and my eyes started to hurt! You clearly love Britain or England in particular, but I was wondering about the earlier post
What traitorous talk is this? I believe technically you could be sent to the Tower of London for talk like that.
Also I noticed that you have the welsh flag flying under your name. Now I'm really confused.

I love an England that now only lives in stories and legands told by our Grandparents

This Island that i live on now is just like a bridge between Heaven and Hell
Becouse it waistes away in purgotory

It has slipped so low into so deep a hole that i think there is no mending it

[craftsman]

Originally Posted by miki78

This Island that i live on now is just like a bridge between Heaven and Hell
Becouse it waistes away in purgotory
It has slipped so low into so deep a hole that i think there is no mending it

Oh No! Is it that bad? What's happened to it? What's it doing down a deep hole?

[Satsui]

Doesn't this fall under the whole "Extreme vs. Mild" theme?

[craftsman]

Originally Posted by Satsui

Doesn't this fall under the whole "Extreme vs. Mild" theme?

I'm not familiar with that theme. Please explain more.

[miki78]

Extreme? Nah its just my dramatic way of putting things

I could go on for ages why this country has had it but its to boring lol

[Kinsao]

^ you and me both *hugs*

i am already preparing myself to leave here...
But, there are a lot of good things about England too!

[miki78]

Your leaving the UK ?

Can i come? lol

Man i so wish i had the money to emigate

Yea i guess there are good things about England just wish i could think of something

[Kinsao]

Well I will try and think of some good things about England.

The weather! Yes! - it might be lousy a lot of the time but you can rest assured it's never boring! (I particularly love the nice crisp cold air of autumn, especially together with gorgeous orange and red leaves; also thunderstorms).
Historical stuff - I like the architecture, of old buildings and also castles and stuff (I know other European countries have this as well, but the English architecture is still nice ).
The fact that it's so small, you can drive around for a relatively short time and still get to see lots of different types of scenery.
For ocean-loving people like me, you are never too far from the sea.

ok, to be a bit balanced, some things i don't like so much about it:
The weather - it might not be boring, but it rains too much. >_>
The public transport - it's expensive, especially trains.
Public holidays - we get the least public holidays in Europe. T_T

Anyway I'm going a bit off the topic of patriotism here!

(I'm not immediately leaving the uk but it is something i'm thinking very seriously about.)