The future of JREF

[thomas]

This thread is dedicated to all comments, reactions and suggestions in regard to our latest announcement re: "The future of JREF". Discuss away!

[PaulTB]

Originally posted by thomas
This thread is dedicated to all comments, reactions and suggestions in regard to our latest announcement re: "The future of JREF". Discuss away!

そうしますっ！

feel that the developments of the past few months

Which I obviously arrived too recently to have caught.

require us to resort to stricter moderation here at the forum in order to enforce certain Rules of Conduct, especially as far as the more popular subsections dealing with pop culture are concerned.

I'm only here for the Japanese Language forum (and the 日本語限定コーナー - if anybody posted there

I would hope that changes will not include (for instance) per-post, pre-display approval for those forums as that would seriously hamper their utility.

For that matter there is no sticky "Terms of Use" or "Read this before posting!" in those forums so I don't know if I've been breaking any rules of conduct (although I doubt it).

[thomas]

Originally posted by PaulTB
For that matter there is no sticky "Terms of Use" or "Read this before posting!" in those forums so I don't know if I've been breaking any rules of conduct (although I doubt it).

There`s a link to the "Forum Guidelines" at the bottom of each page. Besides, you are supposed to read the rules that are displayed right before you click that infamous "Accept" button while signing up.

;)

[PaulTB]

Originally posted by thomas
Besides, you are supposed to read the rules that are displayed right before you click that infamous "Accept" button while signing up.

Life's too short to read, and remember, everything you have to click [Accept] to on the Internet.

Originally posted by thomas
There`s a link to the "Forum Guidelines" at the bottom of each page.

Hmm, so there is.

Probably I never felt the need to go that far down the screen.

From a user interface point of view I think stickies at the top beat links at the bottom every time.

I _did_ actually look along the
Home | User CP | Calendar | Photo Gallery | Quizzes | Market Square | Members | New Posts | FAQ | Logout
line before posting, and even read the FAQ. Frankly I don't think it's going to be getting much attention down on the botton line of the page.

[jeisan]

ah growing pains. if you guys need any help let me know, even if it is just grub work.

oh yeah and if anyone is like me and found this thread before the announcement, you can read it here.

[Elizabeth]

It pretty much goes without saying that restricting content not immediately related to Japan should be the guiding principle of any Japan forum and that extraneous riffraff should be eliminated as much as possible, but I'd hardly say the Photo Gallary was the main offender in this regard.

私はその件を静観する態度を取る。
(I'll take a wait and see attitude.)

[Glenn]

I, too, initially came here for the Japanese Language Forum and the Japanese Only Forum. However, upon looking through some of the other fora, I found that some of them can go on tangents that, while may not relate directly to Japan, offer an opportunity to express ideas and exchange philosophies. While this may not be the express intent of these fora, I do believe that they can be valuable for understanding different ways of thinking, which contribute to the overall richness of the community, and an understanding of different cultures. I think that losing such contributions would be a shame.

Of course, I suppose that the streamlining is intended to get rid of mindless posts more than intellectual conversations, in which case I would be in favor of the change. The question then would be where would the line be drawn (i.e. what exactly would be considered a mindless post)? I suppose that my question is, exactly what content would be considered inappropriate topics for discussion in the fora?

Also, I liked the member gallery. It was nice to see faces behind the screennames and avatars. However, if it must go to save space, then it must go. I can live with that.

[kirei_na_me]

Excellent, Thomas. Thank you for all that you're doing. It is a welcomed change, in my opinion.

[Winter]

I'm looking forward to seeing how this all turns out.

[Iron Chef]

I welcome the proposed changes and look forward to their implementation.

[Keeni84]

I've not been here for too long, but change is good, in my book! Good luck with everything going on.

[Iron Chef]

Re: Glenn's statement of "The question then would be where would the line be drawn (i.e. what exactly would be considered a mindless post)? I suppose that my question is, exactly what content would be considered inappropriate topics for discussion in the fora?" it all comes down to common sense and Moderator/Admin discretion. On the whole, I would say that we've been pretty flexible/tolerant up to this point (maybe too much so...) in what is allowed. If you would like an example of what I personally consider "mindless":

http://www.jref.com/forum/showthread...1267#post61267
http://www.jref.com/forum/showthread...1234#post61234

[Hachiko]

And so I say...

Bring it on.

Hopefully these policies will reduce the number of "bumps" on this board. ;) ;)

[noyhauser]

I think we all know my sentiments on this subject after 3 months of ranting on it....

[Elizabeth]

Originally posted by Iron Chef
Re: Glenn's statement of "The question then would be where would the line be drawn (i.e. what exactly would be considered a mindless post)? I suppose that my question is, exactly what content would be considered inappropriate topics for discussion in the fora?" it all comes down to common sense and Moderator/Admin discretion. On the whole, I would say that we've been pretty flexible/tolerant up to this point (maybe too much so...) in what is allowed. If you would like an example of what I personally consider "mindless":

http://www.jref.com/forum/showthread...1267#post61267
http://www.jref.com/forum/showthread...1234#post61234

Why not retroactively close or delete these threads then? Or at least post a master list of content now considered unacceptable so that everyone is on the same page. Weeding here and there at anyone's discretion doesn't seem likely to make much of a dent in the problem, although hopefully simply raising the issue will make common sense a little more common, for the short term anyway.

[lineartube]

How about a re-shuffle of topics by age layers? The problem of what is refered as "mindless topics" is because of most of them are made by a young audience who don't have yet the skills for engaging in a intellectual stimulant conversation.
They mean well and shouldn't be alienated just because of their age.
I believe that there shouldn't be uselless repression or supression of topics. Just create different layers in the forum that would allow for everyone to be happy about it. Though I must admit that it probably won't be easy, since in my experience I always dealt with visitors from a vertical market and not a horizontal one. One thing I know is that you can't please everybody, so in the end you have to choose what is your targeted-audience. Whithout that definition you won't go far.

[Shidenkai]

To change the actual status of jref is truly a crime! The end of Jref.

[Winter]

In conjunction with lineartube's comment; as older peoples, shouldnt we have developed a tad more patience to tolerate the 'mindless posts'?

After all, they are just children, for the most part.

[Uncle Frank]

To go to a new server that can handle all the bandwidth we need and some left over??? And to leave things the way they are more or less.
Figure in enough bandwidth to run a busy chat room with many members on line.
Now divide the money ammount we need to put us in the futue by the number of really active members. Can it really cost that much?????
I mean I really like things crazy the way it is, and I think we will keep growing if things stay the way they are!!
Could Thomas or someone in admin come up with a dollar figure to give us an idea ????????????

Thanks Frank

[kirei_na_me]

I think lineartube makes some good points.

Also, I think there still needs to be a place where people can talk about light topics. It shouldn't be heavy all the time. Not everyone has the time to master Kanji and not everyone knows every single solitary detail of Japanese history. Then again, not everyone wants to log on here and see nothing but the gazillionth *sweatdrop* as the latest post in that thread.

This is a break for me sometimes. I mean, here I am. 27 years old. Stays at home with kids 24/7. Doesn't get out that much anymore, especially in all this damn snow and ice. Adult conversation is rare, and when I do find it, it is with people that don't have much of a brain. They can only talk about getting their nails done or getting their roots touched up. It's just kind of fun to come in here and chat around with a diverse group of people. Whether it be about where to find rice flour, what's on the mp3 player, or if we think Japan is an intellectual country.

Just need to find balance somehow...

[Maciamo]

Just to reassure those afraid not to be able to discuss non-Japan related matters or just be branded as mindless, we are going to keep the chit-chat section. However, we are also going to separate it into "easy chit-chat" and "serious discussion", so that everybody knows their place.

[lineartube]

My personal opinion about the Jref foruns is that I also like them the way it is, but I also knew that there is always room for improvement, so in the end a revolution might not be needed and the creation of what Maciamo refered as the splitting of the chit-chat section might be a positive step.

[Glenn]

Indeed splitting sections would be good (i.e. the heavy versus light post disparity). However, if the problem is bandwidth then there will only be so much room for everything, in which case it would seem that in order to free up space either the criteria for being allowed membership would have to be tightened, or the nature of what is allowed to be posted would have to be limited.

Sure kids are kids and mean well and all, and I do suppose that we should be able to look past some of the one line "lol" posts, but if these are what is eating up space, then it seems that they should be the first to go, IMHO. After all, does "yeah, lol" relate to Japan in any significant way? If bandwidth weren't a problem, then I wouldn't have too much of a problem with these types of posts, because I try to stray away from them anyway. However, it seems to me that this is a problem, unless I am missing the whole argument for restructuring the fora. Am I missing the point?

Also, I can see Iron Chef's point about the posts to which he linked (and I agree with his discretion), but these seem to me to be obvious examples. I suppose these types of posts will be the only ones restricted by the proposed new rules. Am I right, or is there more grey area?

[kirei_na_me]

There have been a few threads I wish I and could've deleted altogether(not including spam or other extremely obvious ones, of course). You know, how many threads are there that are pretty much about the exact same thing? That's one of the things I'm looking forward to. Maybe having a clearer line drawn, so that decision will be easier to make.

[Glenn]

That is a good point. I have seen already in the month that I have been here the same question asked numerous times. I suppose that it would be impossible to make people use the search function, but perhaps an FAQ section (for threads, in addition to the more technical aspects of navigating the site, etc.)? Of course, this may be more trouble than it is worth, but I wonder... Maybe there is some other way to eliminate these multiple postings of topics.