Need help with translation of this flag please.

Discussion in 'Good Luck Flags & Militaria' started by TK1936, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. TK1936

    TK1936 Kouhai

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    Hello. I was hoping someone would be able to assist me in translation of this Hinomaru flag. Namely, the owners name if present and any phrases that can be read. I have always been interested in these flags but it seems there are many fakes out there and I am not knowledgeble enough to spot the difference. The one column on the right has a bit of a messy style and I thought these are generally very precise. Also the red tabs on the side are not the usual leather I have seen. In any case, any assistance you can give on the translation would be greatly appreciated.
     

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  2. Toritoribe

    Toritoribe 禁漁期
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    The name of the recipient is 渡邊書夫 Watanabe Fumio, and the sender is 長崎市南土浦青年学校 Nagasaki-shi Minami-tsuchiura (or Minami-doura) youth school. However, I can't find any information about the school on the net (and the place name 南土浦 in Nagasaki city, either). I can't judge whether it's genuine or not, but I suspect the authenticity (not only by the school name, but also by the writing style of the slogans and signatures).
     
  3. Uncle Frank

    Uncle Frank SECURITY-you SPAM/we BAN
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    I always wonder about flags that are so white. I was given a flag in 1972 as a going away present. Even though it's stored in an air tight box out of the sunlight , it has turned very yellow colored.
     
  4. TK1936

    TK1936 Kouhai

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    Thank you for the translation. So would the sender refer to a Southern youth school in the Nagasaki Prefecture? I am also unable to locate the supplied description on the net, though I will say finding any info on WWII era schools in Japan seems extremely difficult on the internet. The Watanabe name, from what I am reading is fairly common but would not be out of place on Kyushu. Can you please help with translation of any of the various phrases? I truly hope this is a real flag, I did in fact purchase it, but any insight on why the writing style and signatures seems off would be helpful as well. I would rather hear an educated opinion than not. I plan on displaying this and if it is indeed a true Japanese flag I would be very happy.

    Also, yes I question the vivid white color but it does have a few stains and areas of deterioration. I have a piece of silk uniform my grandfather wore in the service during the early 50's and it too has retained a mostly white coloration (after 30 years in a box in the garage) so I suppose it is not outside of the realm of possibilities.
     
  5. Toritoribe

    Toritoribe 禁漁期
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    It's Nagasaki city, not prefecture (市 "shi" means city), and 南 modifies the following noun, so it means "south of the region Tsuchiura/Doura", not south of Nagasaki city.

    We can find relatively easily detailed region names all over Japan on the net (e.g. Wikipedia or official documents in local governments) nowadays, including obsolete ones. The closest region name I can only find is 茂土浦 "Modoura" in Nagasaki. It's nearly impossible that a region that was used as a youth school's name (not so many in that era, thus, it must be a relatively large region) can't be found on the net from my experience.

    As for slogans, they are very common ones such like Banzai or Hope your eternal good luck in battle. The sender's signatures are only family names without given names, and they are written next to slogans in very small size and in different hand as if it's written afterwords. That's very uncommon and one of the reasons of my suspicion.

    Note that so many fake flags are sold in these days, and fake making groups become more and more very good at making fakes.
     
  6. TK1936

    TK1936 Kouhai

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    Thank you very much for your insight. It is appreciated.
     
  7. Toritoribe

    Toritoribe 禁漁期
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    Correction:
    I googled again and finally found a fact that 長崎市南浦青年学校 Nagasaki-shi Minami-ōura youth school once existed. Sorry for my misreading of the kanji. I should have recalled the name of a famous church 大浦天主堂 in Nagasaki.


    According to the wikipedia page linked below, Minami-ōura youth school was established in April, 1935, and was renamed 長崎市大浦青年学校 Nagasaki-shi Ōura youth school in April, 1941, so the flag would be presented sometime in this period. Now I changed my thought. It might be genuine.

    長崎市立南大浦小学校 - Wikipedia
    (all in Japanese)
     
  8. TK1936

    TK1936 Kouhai

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    Thank you for this update Toritoribe. While I cannot read the Wikipedia link you have provided, I was able to find a very enlightening article at 長崎原爆戦災誌 mentioning this school specifically. The article also explains in detail the use of school children mobilization (or conscription) for war effort labor. This was opened up to higher elementary (according to this article) in 1944. In your opinion, could this flag have been presented to Watanabe Fumio as a child, heading to participate in war labor when called up for service? If not, must he then have been a faculty member who entered the service? Again, I must thank you for the insight, this last post was and will be most helpful in allowing me to research.
     
  9. Toritoribe

    Toritoribe 禁漁期
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    Flags were not presented to child war labors. 祝入営 written before his name clearly shows that the flag was presented when he joined the army, as same as many other hinomaru flags. He was most likely a graduate of the school since the draft age was 20 until 1943.
     
  10. TK1936

    TK1936 Kouhai

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    I see. I mistakenly related "youth school" to the equivalent of elementary school. I think I'll have to stick to reading as my posting only displays my complete lack of knowledge!
     

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