Wiccans in Japan

Discussion in 'All Things Japanese' started by avocado, Feb 7, 2007.

  1. avocado

    avocado 後輩

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    Are there any wiccans in Japan? I am not one, but I have friends who are. I am definitely not an expert, but it seems that the Shinto religion and Wicca have things in common. Just curious...
     
  2. yukio_michael

    yukio_michael Sempai

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    Wicca is a 50 year old pagan pseudo-religion which though not its place of origin (I don't know when the first wiccan wedding was recognized in Britain) wasn't even recognized as a religion at all in the United States until 1985.

    Shinto is a religion at least a few thousand years old, with a vastly large pantheon of deities, or kami which largely defined to some extent the cultural ideals of an entire nation.

    I don't know if or how many wiccans there are in Japan, but I don't think the two religions could be more different.
     
  3. avocado

    avocado 後輩

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    I don't believe in Christianity, but if I called it a "pseudo-religion" I'm pretty sure I'd be verbally crucified. Just saying....:emoji_fearful:
     
  4. GodEmperorLeto

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    By classifying it as a pseudo-religion, Yukio_Michael is perfectly sound. As a classical historian, I have glanced at Wicca, and read Drawing Down the Moon, the closest thing Wicca and Neo-Paganism have to a guiding text.

    Wicca and Neo-Paganism are much more like collections of superstitions with a veneer of pedigree (claiming pre-Christian origins), but have almost nothing in common with the original practices of ancient polytheistic religions, magic, or ritual. Indeed, I've been dismayed to note that most of the Wiccans and Neopagans have more in common with clerics from Dungeons & Dragons than actual practicioners of ancient polytheistic faiths and traditions. Occasionally, I've met followers of specific gods that are well-read and educated in the rituals and magics of their belief system, but those are rare people indeed.

    On the other hand, as Yukio_Michael stated, Shinto is ancient, and continuous. The two couldn't be more different in practice as well as in actual reality.
     
  5. Buntaro

    Buntaro 運動不足

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    Avocado,

    Do not let these statements bother you. If Wicca is your religion, then be proud of it, and say so to anyone who asks. I am not a Wiccan, but I respect your right to be a Wiccan, if you so choose.
     
  6. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    "His" statement, is not only offensive, hateful, and frowned upon by society. It is against public interest. Even I'm a person with mental challenges, I understand what are things I can say, and what are things I shouldn't say.
     
  7. nurizeko

    nurizeko tsuyaku o tsukete kudasai

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    Calling something a pseudo-religion is hardly an insult, merely a factual statement.


    Wiccan in the modern sense has little to no real conncetion with its pre-roman brythonic so called relations.

    Shinto on the other hand is thousands of years old.

    Christmas tree's are more "pagan" then modern paganism.
     
  8. Kinsao

    Kinsao Horizon Rider

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    Seems like a reasonable statement to me, not tryin to make out that the religions are the same or anything but just a curiosity about any similarities that do exist. After all, similarities between one very ancient religion and one very new one, says something kind of interesting about human nature and 'morality' and stuff... imo, anyway.

    Every old religion was brand new at one time...
     
  9. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    Wicca is not a religion. It's a disturbance of peace. Use some common sense.
     
  10. yukio_michael

    yukio_michael Sempai

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    I don't think that there is anything which Kinsao said that lacked common sense. Your statement on the other hand...

    I would have said the same thing, but chose not to. It's natural for religions to have things in common, many do, that is the nature of religion, but regardless I still stand by my original statement.

    It's also true what Kinsao said about all religions being new at one point in time. Christians we remember suffered for their faith in ancient times more or less until Constantine's state adoption of the religion, only a few years after its 'legalization'. Then of course, the Christians went on to do all manner of things in the name of their religion, but that's another thing entirely...

    By law, for purposes of the right of people to practice Wicca, its needed to call Wicca a religion, but by and large it doesn't really have any of the attributes of what we typically think of a relgion, and is closer to what GodEmperorLeto said, a collection of superstitions...
     
  11. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    I really don't understand what's with justice these days. What happened to law? how is it that in society these cult groups walk in public, and tell people to join. I'm starting to feel as if the law is weakening, and the law is failing at doing it's job.

    I can't believe it that, these days they're letting falu gung, and wiccans out in the public, playing with their bscraft, or bs kung fu. I may sound rude, but this is how I'll always feel about cults like that.

    I can't help myself, from thinking this way. Even I'm a person in a country where we can express the most freedom. I guess maybe it's because the Canadian special educators taught me pretty well. On what is dignity, common sense, and how judge what is evil.

    If you tell me that wicca is nothing evil, then can you at least tell me this? all my life the people who gave me a basic special education(I'm mentally challenged), and the people who trains me at special olympic, are made up of a majority of catholic people, other than that, some are christians, and then the rest are buddhists.

    On the other hand why is it that the wicca and falu gung does nothing for the society, but play with god forsaken stuff?
     
  12. Kinsao

    Kinsao Horizon Rider

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    I really don't know the definition of "cult" properly, but wiccans don't go around pressurising other people to "join". As far as I can tell it's a rather peaceful kind of religion/superstition/whatever you call it, that doesn't try to interfere with other people's lifestyles. Sure, I bet there's a few annoying wiccans the same as there's annoying people in any faith, but all the wiccans I've known (admittedly only a handful!) have been quite, umm, normal. :emoji_blush:
     
  13. KirinMan

    KirinMan Sempai

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    I think that in some cases it is more by chance than by any conscious thought by the "founders" to create the impression that they are similar.

    Take a look at three of the worlds "major" religions, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, how different they all are and yet how many similarities they also have as well, seeing as they all grew out of each other to a certain extent.

    I am by no means an expert or even know much about Wiccans, other than what I have read on the 'net. However I think that it was only recognized as a religion in the US, because it was in the US and the laws there that are very tolerant of religion and what individual's choose to believe in.

    To me anyway, religion is a very private matter, and each individual has the "right" to believe in what they want to believe in, and others hopefully will respect that right of choice.

    There are similarites between Buddhism and Shinto as well, not knowing too many of the tennents of what makes a person a believer in Wicca(?) is it possible that Wiccans beliefs are closer to the beliefs of Buddhism than Shinto?
     
  14. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    Umm no offense kinsao, but sometimes what the wiccan people practice can be quite scarey. I seen a lot of things kinsao... I think wiccan symbolize unhealthy things. No offense, but how do you expect the public to not be scared by this type of people. If they're usually groups formed with people looking all weird, with odd looking books in their hand written by... some of the less favorable citizens.

    I seen firearms, I seen drug, I seen people from the shelters, but seeing a group of people chanting in a circle still scares me.
     
  15. KirinMan

    KirinMan Sempai

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    Well then you just might want to stay out of a Catholic Church too when they have their weekly prayer "circle".
     
  16. .::b|ue Ash::.

    .::b|ue Ash::. 4n1m3 0bss3s3d

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    Avacado: To answer your question, yes I'm sure there are SOME wiccans in Japan, but only in minuit amounts, many Japanese, specially younger generations are not highly religious.

    As far as the rest of this religious discussion goes... I don't think it's something which most people should speak about.
    Giving ones skewed opinion on religion is helpful to no one, and only creates arguments.
    I happen to study religions as a past time, though I am far from an expert.

    Deep down, pretty much all religions have things in common.
    Off hand, to me, Shinto and Wicca have more similarities then Shinto and Christians.
    Both Shinto and Wiccan's have an appreciation for things of this earth, and various types of "deities" or which ever term you care to use.

    Many people feel, specially from the Eclectic Pagan path, that religions can be changed, made new, mixed, etc. That it is whatever makes sense to you, and that you believe in that matters, that is what makes a religion.
    Yes Wicca is a new religion (neo-pagan) actually refers to something which is new typically less then 100 years old (at least in documented proof).
    Neo-Pagan's, the type who you might think of as seen on the TV shows are as common in those religions as there are Christians who claim to be Christian but still drink/smoke/sex before marriage, you name it.
    In every religion you will find people who are religious for the wrong reason.

    Do not worry, concerning what some other people have said on here. While those are their feelings that is fine.
    If anything neo-pagan religions try to teach the feeling of acceptance of ALL religions, and acceptance of those who choose to practice them.

    For the record, I am not religious.
    I was born and raised Mormon and never believed it, later became a born again Christian and it did not work out. I have been studying religions for nearly 13 years now, all of them fascinating.
    I am currently focusing my efforts on Taoism.
     
  17. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    Is that how you really feel about the catholic church?

    Are you replying with honesty?
     
  18. yukio_michael

    yukio_michael Sempai

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    I think the inference was vague, yet clear to me.

    Do people who express their beliefs as a group unnerve you?
     
  19. KirinMan

    KirinMan Sempai

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    The inference was intentionally vague, and I'm sorry if that was misunderstood. It isn't just the Catholic Church that joins together in a group to pray. Many other religions have "group" gatherings as well.


    No and Yes to the questions above.

    Yukio placed the question to you much better than I did. I was interested to know what makes you feel uncomfortable about group prayer or why people who pray in groups makes you feel uncomfortable.
     
  20. GoodBilly

    GoodBilly Suspended

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    There's no reason for me or the public to feel uncomfortable about being in a catholic church. Other than this answer, I can't seriously answer your other questions.


    Maybe it's your way of expressing humor by comparing a catholic church with Wicca. It is like saying Vatican city is Haiti. Roman catholicism is Haiti's state religion, but it does not make it another Vatican city. You can't compare prayer with witchcraft, and expect me to answer your questions seriously.
     
  21. KirinMan

    KirinMan Sempai

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    No it wasn't it was a serious question about how you feel. That wasnt the point. The point was feeling comfortable or not in group prayer settings.
    Also thanks for being honest about saying that you can not reply to the other questions.

    You have made yourself very clear here by saying that you think that Wiccans are practicing witchcraft. I would be willing to bet that they don't agree with you that they are praying as well.

    Prayer is different to different people no matter the "settings" that they take place in. American Indians prayed to their God's in many different ways as well, one way was dancing around a camp fire, to them and many others, that is their way of praying to the God or god's that they believe in. I only write this to give you an example of what I mean by prayer, but not a type of prayer that is considered to be traditional or inside of a house of worship. To them the world around them is their house of worship and I respect them for what they believe in, whether I agree or not matters nothing.

    Religion is also an extremely sensitive subject to many (most?) people. Please try to remember that not everyone is going to agree with you either.

    What matters is what you believe. Don't let anyone tell you differently,
     
  22. I'm a wiccan, although a lot of people don't know of wicca, but many more know of Paganism. So I call myself a Pagan.

    In wicca, there are many different gods, deities if you will, although some wiccans class them all as one god.
    I worship not just Pagan pantheons, but Celtic pantheons, greek pantheons, and many more. I live in an environment where wiccanism is 'of the devil', although it isn't. So to my local area, I am atheist.

    Don't ever be discouraged by what others tell you. They may not like what you do, but they don't have to say anything if they disagree. Nobody can honestly say there is a god. So have your own beliefs, and listen to others, but never get discouraged or offended.

    A wiccan is not praying when they practice Magick, but they call upon the Gods or a particular god or number of gods to aid them. You must always thank your gods afterwards.
    Anywhere you go, you may practice wicca, wherever feels comfortable, even next to a cliff. You feel comfortable so that you can ground your power more, so that you can feel in touch with the world.

    Don't forget, everybody worships god/gods/religion differently. Even those who support the same god practice in different ways.
    And no, you don't have to practice 'witchcraft' to be a wiccan.
    Only now am I realising this, that you don't have to pander to be with the 'mainstream' religion of your area. You must ignore what others are telling you and find your own way through life.

    I thank you for reading.
     
  23. kireikoori

    kireikoori Suspended

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    There's much ignorance in this thread...
    That's a funny thing to say.
    I'm no Wiccan but Shinto is very similar to Wiccan just because they are both Pagan religions.
    You're lumping Wiccans in with all other Neo-Pagans. <_<
    The revivial of pre-Christian Pagan religions is NOT psuedo-religion. Have you even met someone involved in Ásatrú ever? Norse religion is pretty ancient..just as ancient as Japanese Shinto.

    The only think Shinto couldn't be more different from is Abrahamic religion.

    Anyway I do not think that many neo-pagans exist in Japan as their Pagan religion is still intact. To find someone who wants to reconstruct European Pagan religions would be a bit rare as they have their own. Japanese people do have the tendancy towards "syncretism" though. So there might be some people who are a mixture like Shinto/Druid, Shinto/Ásatrú or something like that.

    As a Neo-Pagan myself I see alot of enrichment for Shinto to add to my mix of Pagan beliefs.
     
  24. pugtm

    pugtm Jewish Samurai

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    there is a huge difference between the two but all pagan religions are basically the same. If i had to pick a closest to shinto though it would be hinduism. Wiccan has completely different roots.
    But seriously why argue about this kind of stuff? all he asked was if any lived in japan. the answer is probably the same as with almost any other religion; yes but very few and almost all are in the us military stationed there.
    seriously with religion we can all believe what we want and we'll find out the truth when we die and go to heaven or get reincarnated or whatnot.
     
  25. kireikoori

    kireikoori Suspended

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    That's an interesting thing to say...
    To my knowledge Wicca takes alot of influence from Celtic faith.
    The Celtic faith and Norse faith both have origins in Vedic faith(Hinduism)..especially Celtic.

    Though Dharmic religion(Buddhaism) has had a heavy influence on Shinto I should think if any religion could be closely related to Shinto it would be Tengri.
     

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